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[Music]

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hello and welcome to the show

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i'm martin wilsher host my guest this

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evening is thomas wortman

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um he's been involved in this topic for

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many years

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we're going to be talking a lot about

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some really interesting cases that

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happen in ohio

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but we're not going to limit limit it to

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just ohio there's a

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actually something else i would like uh

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for him to talk about that he's been

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looking into

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and uh happy new year everyone i'm boy i

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almost forgot

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and uh hey 2020 don't let the door hit

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you on the way out

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uh we can celebrate that this is the end

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of 2020 uh first time i've ever felt

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that way but

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i'm ready for uh to move on and i hope

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you're uh happy and healthy

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and have a much better 2021

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i learned a long time ago never say it

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can't get worse

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so i'm not going to say that i'm just

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going to say let's just all hope and

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let's do our part

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um to stay safe and so we'll be around

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to see the good times and they are

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they are coming if you head over to

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podcastufo.com

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our blog this week is about a famous ufo

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encounter uh that i never heard of and

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it happened in

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uh imelton poland on

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may 10th 1978. a farmer named

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jan wolitsky was in a

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cart with his horse and

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it's a very very strange encounter and

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uh so if they call it poland's roswell

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so check that out that was 42 years ago

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and uh

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that is our blog this week all our blogs

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as i

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mentioned that are part of our podcast

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feed as an

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audio blog each week and they're also on

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youtube

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they come out every friday so you can

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check that out if you're too lazy to

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read i know that i am sometimes i have

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to be honest

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that i wait for the audio blog just when

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i'm busy

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though so but if you read the blog

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you will see that there's a lot of links

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to

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things that are you know of note in the

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blogs

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charles does put a lot of links in the

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blogs and you can

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read the the interesting backstories

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of where he gets his information if you

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support the show

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i want to thank you very much and i

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couldn't do it without your help

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if you're not a supporter i understand

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and uh i do thank you for listening

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and for just two dollars a month anyone

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can support the show

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it's over a patreon and um about our

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guests i'm gonna let him talk about his

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background i have seen him

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um on various ufo tv

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programs over the years and it should be

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good and

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i'm gonna start talk about my next

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week's

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guest in the beginning of the show

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because i always say it at the end

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and i do realize that a lot of people

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don't listen to the full show

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it depends um you know uh so

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and i totally get that because i don't

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listen to all the podcasts i listen to

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all the way through

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so our guest next week should be really

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interesting

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and you will have heard a story you have

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not heard before

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um this gentleman was on the west coast

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and he had quite an amazing uh quite an

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amazing sighting

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his whole family are uh scientists and

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science related

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as well as himself um his name is tim

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senor and uh they had an incredible

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sighting he's gonna be talking about it

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it's just mine mind boggling all the

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things that happen

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in front of his whole family and uh and

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uh it should be a very interesting show

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tim senor next week

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and that is it i've been babbling way

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too

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long here it's time to get our guests in

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welcome to the show thomas

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oh thanks for having me i was uh talking

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to you off air and

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you know you were on the show just about

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six years ago

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something like that yeah and our tech

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has totally changed

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since and i i tried to listen to that

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show i couldn't even understand what you

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were saying

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i'm impressed with what i'm seeing right

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now i got to believe

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it's great yeah i mean you do a podcast

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that's why you're

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completely set up with great audio and

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and you're

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you're you're ready to do the show which

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is always great to have great audio so i

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appreciate that

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oh no problem yeah and uh just before we

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forget your

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your um uh

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trying to remember ufo artists it's ufo

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it's it's called you fine

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you've thought a secret odyssey it's on

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odyssey

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um network and actually the guy who gave

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him permission

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to set up this whole network of that

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they've got

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was gene roddenberry huh star trek

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really yeah seriously yeah oh yeah

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you'll hear commercials on there where

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basically you know he's

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some stuff they've got tape from a long

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time ago but

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when i got involved with it i was at a

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star trek little thing event going on

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they said hey would you like to do a

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podcast on our network

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so what yeah yeah so we

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you know we got together hooked things

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up and it's been going on now what two

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years now

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something like that all right wow and so

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i do want to talk to you about something

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you discussed on one of the shows that i

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got a chance to listen to and uh so

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uh but before we do all that um uh you

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know six years was a long time ago a lot

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of people don't know who you are

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so why don't you introduce yourself

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sometime i don't know who i am

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you know i know what you're saying so

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yeah uh why don't you introduce yourself

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and uh

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tell us a little bit about you and what

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got you interested in the ufo

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um i'm tom wortman i'm the state

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director

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for the mutual ufo network of ohio and i

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got involved with this thing um

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i caught best way i can describe it

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under martin is

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midlife crisis you know as we get older

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you know which life crisis was it though

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the first one or the second well let's

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see the corvette was number one the

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motorcycle was number two this is number

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three i guess you know okay

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but uh you know i was sitting around the

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house one weekend

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and i was looking for other things to do

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because you get older you just can't do

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the things

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physically that i used to be able to do

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is when i was younger

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because i was in martial arts and all

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sorts of stuff like that but my body

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can't handle that anymore

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so i was listening to somebody else's

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podcast on ufos

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and i think actually it goes back to the

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days of like art bill

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and i was listening to this podcast i

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said you know i just wonder if

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somebody in my area which i'm from

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cleveland ohio

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does anything related to ufos

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so i go on the internet google it and i

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found a smaller group

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called the cleveland ufology project

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they actually had a meeting and i call

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it kind of like a

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karma they met about a mile from my

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house

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on the weekend i googled the whole thing

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so i went down sat in on one of their

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meetings

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nice people the they were talking about

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their own experiences

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and i just kind of sat back and just

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listened but i thought hey this is kind

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of interesting on there so i joined up

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with the group

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and they've actually been an existing

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martin by the way since 1952.

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oh wow yeah meeting since 1952.

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and they've had a number of good

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individuals with them and some great

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stories we'd have to talk about sometime

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including potential involvement with

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uh one of their members doing a autopsy

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on an alien at right path

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yeah i mean you're right in the hub

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there with uh a lot of

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a lot of mystery of ufos right right

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there right now that's right

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and he by the way was a doctor a

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physician

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that was called in supposedly but that's

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a whole nother situation on there

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well i joined with them i started

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getting involved doing uh

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some research talk about some things at

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their meetings but it didn't feed the

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fire

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you know i want to get out and start

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doing some investigations

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doing the research because i'm the

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computer geek

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that i'm sitting behind my computer

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right now i've got three monitors in

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front

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i've got all this access to information

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i've got a half of my garage by the way

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is completely full of ufo research

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material going all the way back to the

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50s and before

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so i you know i started gathering all

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this stuff and i thought you know i want

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to do the investigation side

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and it goes back now over 10 years ago

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now

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that i joined up with mufon and started

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doing

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field investigations and i loved it

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and i would sit at my computer for hours

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just

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researching things talking to people

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making notes

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and working cases and i don't know how

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many cases i've done right now i lost

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count

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i did probably about 400 plus the united

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states but then

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with the case assistance group i joined

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with them

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and i started doing cases in the united

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kingdom i've done like 200 cases over

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there long distance

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another littered in canada puerto rico

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south pacific all over the world i've

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done cases

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so let me just ask you this if we just

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take a pause here

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when you're doing a research on when

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you're investigating

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cases elsewhere at a distance

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um how how does one do that oh it's a

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challenge

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the thing that i do is i use every

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resource i've got

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first of all like looking at man-made

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objects like aircraft

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00:10:48,069 --> 00:10:45,360
i've got a access to

285
00:10:50,790 --> 00:10:48,079
flight radar 24 professional which i can

286
00:10:52,710 --> 00:10:50,800
go back two years on flight plans

287
00:10:55,990 --> 00:10:52,720
but more recently i've been able to get

288
00:10:57,750 --> 00:10:56,000
into view some of the military flights

289
00:10:59,509 --> 00:10:57,760
not necessarily fighter jets and so

290
00:11:01,910 --> 00:10:59,519
forth but a lot of stuff they've got

291
00:11:03,829 --> 00:11:01,920
transporting around the country

292
00:11:06,150 --> 00:11:03,839
i've made connections in other areas

293
00:11:07,910 --> 00:11:06,160
where i found out that actually ham

294
00:11:08,630 --> 00:11:07,920
radio operators may actually be picking

295
00:11:10,150 --> 00:11:08,640
up certain

296
00:11:11,910 --> 00:11:10,160
radio transmissions from different

297
00:11:13,910 --> 00:11:11,920
aircraft in the region

298
00:11:15,509 --> 00:11:13,920
so you start using every resource you

299
00:11:18,389 --> 00:11:15,519
can google

300
00:11:20,470 --> 00:11:18,399
uh going into google earth and i'll

301
00:11:23,190 --> 00:11:20,480
start looking at also blogs

302
00:11:23,829 --> 00:11:23,200
potentially in that region and it's a

303
00:11:25,990 --> 00:11:23,839
challenge

304
00:11:27,190 --> 00:11:26,000
but i think it really strengthened my

305
00:11:30,470 --> 00:11:27,200
abilities

306
00:11:31,590 --> 00:11:30,480
to go out and do a lot of research to do

307
00:11:34,069 --> 00:11:31,600
a lot of analysis

308
00:11:35,990 --> 00:11:34,079
and i really love that part and i did

309
00:11:37,910 --> 00:11:36,000
that for a number of years and i just

310
00:11:40,550 --> 00:11:37,920
started backing out because

311
00:11:42,550 --> 00:11:40,560
just not enough time in a day now do you

312
00:11:45,030 --> 00:11:42,560
actually solve a lot of these

313
00:11:46,710 --> 00:11:45,040
actually quite a few and there's been

314
00:11:50,150 --> 00:11:46,720
some really interesting ones

315
00:11:54,470 --> 00:11:50,160
um i did one in the case united kingdom

316
00:11:57,430 --> 00:11:54,480
as an example where the individual

317
00:11:58,949 --> 00:11:57,440
submitted a picture of an object which

318
00:12:00,310 --> 00:11:58,959
appeared like a star

319
00:12:03,750 --> 00:12:00,320
you could see it come from the ground

320
00:12:05,750 --> 00:12:03,760
going straight up almost like a rocket

321
00:12:07,670 --> 00:12:05,760
and it stopped stationary and you had a

322
00:12:10,069 --> 00:12:07,680
reference of a steeple

323
00:12:11,110 --> 00:12:10,079
in the town that you could see it behind

324
00:12:12,949 --> 00:12:11,120
it

325
00:12:16,069 --> 00:12:12,959
well one of the things i thought of back

326
00:12:17,829 --> 00:12:16,079
then is you know it's maybe it's a drone

327
00:12:20,310 --> 00:12:17,839
because i like to look at the potential

328
00:12:22,310 --> 00:12:20,320
you know known explanations

329
00:12:25,110 --> 00:12:22,320
well i contact individual we had a lot

330
00:12:28,069 --> 00:12:25,120
of conversations back and forth

331
00:12:29,670 --> 00:12:28,079
and i suggested uh i said is there

332
00:12:31,190 --> 00:12:29,680
potentially anybody flying drones in

333
00:12:33,190 --> 00:12:31,200
your region

334
00:12:34,949 --> 00:12:33,200
and it was like telling somebody they

335
00:12:38,150 --> 00:12:34,959
saw venus

336
00:12:39,910 --> 00:12:38,160
it did not go over that well

337
00:12:41,190 --> 00:12:39,920
and i'm just suggesting i'm not saying

338
00:12:44,629 --> 00:12:41,200
it is

339
00:12:47,990 --> 00:12:44,639
oh he got very arrogant about it and

340
00:12:50,550 --> 00:12:48,000
i said okay let's dig in deeper

341
00:12:51,509 --> 00:12:50,560
so i dug in deeper i go on google earth

342
00:12:54,710 --> 00:12:51,519
and i put myself

343
00:12:57,030 --> 00:12:54,720
walking from his flat around the town

344
00:12:58,470 --> 00:12:57,040
and no more than a hundred yards from

345
00:13:01,350 --> 00:12:58,480
his house

346
00:13:04,550 --> 00:13:01,360
his flat was a hobby shop and what they

347
00:13:06,310 --> 00:13:04,560
have in the front window but a drone

348
00:13:09,430 --> 00:13:06,320
and he said nobody flies in the whole

349
00:13:12,949 --> 00:13:09,440
area they're not available

350
00:13:15,269 --> 00:13:12,959
then i go deeper and i find on youtube

351
00:13:17,110 --> 00:13:15,279
a video of a fireworks display on the

352
00:13:19,110 --> 00:13:17,120
same day he took his video which he

353
00:13:21,590 --> 00:13:19,120
could hear fireworks in the background

354
00:13:23,269 --> 00:13:21,600
of his video and somebody was using a

355
00:13:25,509 --> 00:13:23,279
drone to go up and take aerial

356
00:13:29,030 --> 00:13:25,519
photographs of

357
00:13:30,470 --> 00:13:29,040
the fireworks yeah yeah

358
00:13:32,069 --> 00:13:30,480
so we're going to see a lot of drones i

359
00:13:33,670 --> 00:13:32,079
know there was

360
00:13:35,110 --> 00:13:33,680
there was some great work done by i

361
00:13:37,350 --> 00:13:35,120
think john

362
00:13:38,710 --> 00:13:37,360
jonathan or doug douglas i can't

363
00:13:41,030 --> 00:13:38,720
remember his last name

364
00:13:42,150 --> 00:13:41,040
that did some great work on the colorado

365
00:13:45,110 --> 00:13:42,160
drones but we're

366
00:13:46,949 --> 00:13:45,120
we're going to be um and i think

367
00:13:48,069 --> 00:13:46,959
something yesterday just yesterday was

368
00:13:51,110 --> 00:13:48,079
approved by

369
00:13:52,949 --> 00:13:51,120
the faa for drones delivering

370
00:13:55,110 --> 00:13:52,959
i think it was ups or something like

371
00:13:55,990 --> 00:13:55,120
that i'm i'm not really sure and i don't

372
00:13:57,509 --> 00:13:56,000
want to give

373
00:13:59,590 --> 00:13:57,519
this information out there but there was

374
00:14:02,790 --> 00:13:59,600
something on the news about that

375
00:14:05,189 --> 00:14:02,800
but we are going to be seeing a lot

376
00:14:05,910 --> 00:14:05,199
of drones and a lot of drones are going

377
00:14:08,710 --> 00:14:05,920
to be

378
00:14:09,910 --> 00:14:08,720
considered ufos and you're right there

379
00:14:13,750 --> 00:14:09,920
there is a great

380
00:14:16,710 --> 00:14:13,760
video that was a supposed ufo

381
00:14:18,790 --> 00:14:16,720
in a city where it showed this thing

382
00:14:21,590 --> 00:14:18,800
shoot right up to the top of a

383
00:14:23,350 --> 00:14:21,600
skyscraper and you know you thought for

384
00:14:24,710 --> 00:14:23,360
sure it had to be some type of ufo ended

385
00:14:27,829 --> 00:14:24,720
up being a drone

386
00:14:31,269 --> 00:14:27,839
and it would just the way it excelled

387
00:14:32,310 --> 00:14:31,279
was you know it was boggling how fast

388
00:14:35,990 --> 00:14:32,320
that thing shot up

389
00:14:39,590 --> 00:14:36,000
oh it's amazing uh one of my

390
00:14:43,110 --> 00:14:39,600
investigators was in contact with

391
00:14:45,590 --> 00:14:43,120
a local ham radio group and they monitor

392
00:14:46,550 --> 00:14:45,600
military operations areas is in southern

393
00:14:49,590 --> 00:14:46,560
ohio

394
00:14:51,030 --> 00:14:49,600
with some of the um reserve units flying

395
00:14:53,030 --> 00:14:51,040
jets down here

396
00:14:54,629 --> 00:14:53,040
well they were told that in the future

397
00:14:56,870 --> 00:14:54,639
they're going to be flying drones in

398
00:14:58,790 --> 00:14:56,880
that same area

399
00:15:00,150 --> 00:14:58,800
doing training exercises in southern

400
00:15:02,790 --> 00:15:00,160
ohio

401
00:15:03,189 --> 00:15:02,800
so we've had people citing military jets

402
00:15:06,230 --> 00:15:03,199
you know

403
00:15:07,509 --> 00:15:06,240
that they think are ufos doing

404
00:15:09,189 --> 00:15:07,519
all these lights moving around the sky

405
00:15:10,389 --> 00:15:09,199
at night well they're actually military

406
00:15:13,189 --> 00:15:10,399
jets but now we're going to be seeing

407
00:15:17,910 --> 00:15:13,199
drones doing the same thing

408
00:15:20,710 --> 00:15:17,920
and i even saw a thing where at area 51

409
00:15:22,150 --> 00:15:20,720
they've added on like this big canopy

410
00:15:23,350 --> 00:15:22,160
almost like a tent off one of the

411
00:15:25,509 --> 00:15:23,360
buildings

412
00:15:28,230 --> 00:15:25,519
and what they're speculating is they're

413
00:15:29,910 --> 00:15:28,240
sta they're bringing drones in

414
00:15:33,110 --> 00:15:29,920
and setting them up in swarms for

415
00:15:35,189 --> 00:15:33,120
training for training exercises

416
00:15:36,949 --> 00:15:35,199
that that's the next wave of the fighter

417
00:15:38,629 --> 00:15:36,959
generations or at least

418
00:15:42,550 --> 00:15:38,639
aircraft generations coming out is going

419
00:15:45,990 --> 00:15:44,870
well lewis i'm sorry i i feel your pain

420
00:15:47,910 --> 00:15:46,000
there poor

421
00:15:49,189 --> 00:15:47,920
guy in our chat room just destroyed a 2

422
00:15:53,430 --> 00:15:49,199
800

423
00:15:59,430 --> 00:15:55,189
and i'd be upset if i had destroyed my

424
00:16:03,269 --> 00:16:01,030
yeah they can get expensive and they can

425
00:16:04,710 --> 00:16:03,279
do amazing things and you can imagine

426
00:16:06,310 --> 00:16:04,720
what the government has

427
00:16:07,990 --> 00:16:06,320
you know i mean we already know a lot of

428
00:16:09,430 --> 00:16:08,000
what they have but um

429
00:16:11,509 --> 00:16:09,440
you know the things that we don't know

430
00:16:14,150 --> 00:16:11,519
they have uh

431
00:16:15,829 --> 00:16:14,160
and you know i i asked you to introduce

432
00:16:17,350 --> 00:16:15,839
yourself and and i sort of interrupted

433
00:16:20,150 --> 00:16:17,360
you get you on this

434
00:16:21,670 --> 00:16:20,160
path uh but were you basically done in

435
00:16:23,430 --> 00:16:21,680
explaining how you got it

436
00:16:25,030 --> 00:16:23,440
well pretty much basically i got

437
00:16:26,949 --> 00:16:25,040
involved in mufon and i just

438
00:16:28,310 --> 00:16:26,959
like a lot of people in mufon we work

439
00:16:31,509 --> 00:16:28,320
our way up the ladder

440
00:16:34,069 --> 00:16:31,519
uh i went from field investigator up to

441
00:16:36,470 --> 00:16:34,079
state section director and then

442
00:16:39,509 --> 00:16:36,480
eventually became state director

443
00:16:42,870 --> 00:16:39,519
and that's where i've been now for

444
00:16:48,310 --> 00:16:45,910
and uh what what is the activity of

445
00:16:49,269 --> 00:16:48,320
ohio like these days like as far as

446
00:16:52,150 --> 00:16:49,279
reports

447
00:16:53,509 --> 00:16:52,160
contemporary we're getting i pulled a

448
00:16:55,910 --> 00:16:53,519
lot of them up before

449
00:16:57,670 --> 00:16:55,920
the show and we're getting a lot of the

450
00:17:00,230 --> 00:16:57,680
stuff probably a lot of other people are

451
00:17:01,990 --> 00:17:00,240
is most of them consist of the distance

452
00:17:03,990 --> 00:17:02,000
lights in the sky

453
00:17:05,429 --> 00:17:04,000
that just people see light patterns

454
00:17:08,949 --> 00:17:05,439
moving in in the

455
00:17:10,870 --> 00:17:08,959
lights moving in on patterns and

456
00:17:12,549 --> 00:17:10,880
from what i saw i pulled up some data on

457
00:17:16,789 --> 00:17:12,559
it just real quick

458
00:17:17,990 --> 00:17:16,799
um of the identified we're identifying

459
00:17:20,949 --> 00:17:18,000
about 70 percent

460
00:17:23,029 --> 00:17:20,959
of what we're seeing in the sky is being

461
00:17:26,230 --> 00:17:23,039
either man-made or celestial

462
00:17:28,710 --> 00:17:26,240
something along those lines we get

463
00:17:30,470 --> 00:17:28,720
that occasional case that pops up out of

464
00:17:33,669 --> 00:17:30,480
nowhere

465
00:17:34,950 --> 00:17:33,679
just just leaves your head scratching

466
00:17:37,029 --> 00:17:34,960
and i think you want to talk about one

467
00:17:40,870 --> 00:17:37,039
of those later on

468
00:17:43,350 --> 00:17:40,880
yeah and uh we had another one pop up uh

469
00:17:45,830 --> 00:17:43,360
right around 2012 was a major crop

470
00:17:47,590 --> 00:17:45,840
circle formation

471
00:17:49,909 --> 00:17:47,600
that i got involved in doing the the

472
00:17:52,789 --> 00:17:49,919
investigation with and that was

473
00:17:54,310 --> 00:17:52,799
wild let's talk about that if you don't

474
00:17:57,990 --> 00:17:54,320
mind i'd like to hear more

475
00:18:00,870 --> 00:17:58,000
about sure yeah well this happened back

476
00:18:01,909 --> 00:18:00,880
right around september 20th of um it had

477
00:18:03,510 --> 00:18:01,919
to be going back to

478
00:18:05,990 --> 00:18:03,520
i got i'm pulling my notes up here real

479
00:18:07,510 --> 00:18:06,000
quick 2012.

480
00:18:10,070 --> 00:18:07,520
a friend of mine i was involved with in

481
00:18:13,430 --> 00:18:10,080
the in the cleveland ufology project

482
00:18:15,190 --> 00:18:13,440
um aaron took and

483
00:18:17,510 --> 00:18:15,200
saw a picture on the internet from an

484
00:18:18,870 --> 00:18:17,520
aircraft of a crop circle in southern

485
00:18:21,430 --> 00:18:18,880
ohio

486
00:18:22,870 --> 00:18:21,440
what caught us attention was it was near

487
00:18:24,549 --> 00:18:22,880
indian mountains

488
00:18:26,710 --> 00:18:24,559
there's a couple major indian mound

489
00:18:30,150 --> 00:18:26,720
formations ohio one is hope well

490
00:18:32,310 --> 00:18:30,160
one is the serpent mounds well he has a

491
00:18:34,310 --> 00:18:32,320
contact jeff wilson

492
00:18:36,549 --> 00:18:34,320
and aaron clark sent the photograph over

493
00:18:39,270 --> 00:18:36,559
to jeff wilson said hey check this out

494
00:18:40,070 --> 00:18:39,280
well jeff wilson heads an organization

495
00:18:41,909 --> 00:18:40,080
called

496
00:18:45,270 --> 00:18:41,919
international crop circle research

497
00:18:48,470 --> 00:18:45,280
organization or association i should say

498
00:18:49,029 --> 00:18:48,480
so jeff is very aggressive he tracked

499
00:18:51,830 --> 00:18:49,039
down

500
00:18:52,870 --> 00:18:51,840
where the formation was he located the

501
00:18:54,230 --> 00:18:52,880
farmer

502
00:18:56,390 --> 00:18:54,240
who owned the property actually the

503
00:18:58,789 --> 00:18:56,400
person who owned a property and got

504
00:19:00,310 --> 00:18:58,799
permission to go in to do a research on

505
00:19:03,430 --> 00:19:00,320
it

506
00:19:04,870 --> 00:19:03,440
so me i said hey aaron i said can we

507
00:19:08,390 --> 00:19:04,880
piggyback in on this with

508
00:19:11,110 --> 00:19:08,400
jeff and i want to check this thing out

509
00:19:12,789 --> 00:19:11,120
so he contacted jeff we were able to go

510
00:19:14,390 --> 00:19:12,799
along with him we met at like

511
00:19:16,070 --> 00:19:14,400
five six in the morning something like

512
00:19:17,909 --> 00:19:16,080
that we drove a couple hundred miles to

513
00:19:19,990 --> 00:19:17,919
get there

514
00:19:21,510 --> 00:19:20,000
the thing i found out it wasn't in in

515
00:19:22,310 --> 00:19:21,520
wheat wasn't it oats kind of like the

516
00:19:25,909 --> 00:19:22,320
ones you see in

517
00:19:31,590 --> 00:19:29,029
i mean think about in corn a formation

518
00:19:33,669 --> 00:19:31,600
being made how difficult that would be

519
00:19:36,390 --> 00:19:33,679
of let's say a couple guys bob and dave

520
00:19:39,510 --> 00:19:36,400
or whoever going out and forming this

521
00:19:41,750 --> 00:19:39,520
well we go down in and the farmer

522
00:19:43,190 --> 00:19:41,760
had some of the corn harvested right up

523
00:19:45,510 --> 00:19:43,200
to the edge of the crop circle to make

524
00:19:47,909 --> 00:19:45,520
it easier for us to get in

525
00:19:49,190 --> 00:19:47,919
and they gave us only one day to do all

526
00:19:52,230 --> 00:19:49,200
the research

527
00:19:55,029 --> 00:19:52,240
of that crop circle well it was in this

528
00:19:57,190 --> 00:19:55,039
unique formation and i'm probably going

529
00:19:59,590 --> 00:19:57,200
to butcher the name but it's called the

530
00:20:01,510 --> 00:19:59,600
exact let's start out with this first it

531
00:20:04,710 --> 00:20:01,520
was actually a series of spirals

532
00:20:07,430 --> 00:20:04,720
of about 43 circles where you had these

533
00:20:09,750 --> 00:20:07,440
circles coming off like an arm from big

534
00:20:11,270 --> 00:20:09,760
going smaller smaller smaller smaller

535
00:20:13,190 --> 00:20:11,280
and they were spiraling around and you

536
00:20:15,270 --> 00:20:13,200
had seven of these arms coming off of

537
00:20:18,390 --> 00:20:15,280
this center circle

538
00:20:21,190 --> 00:20:18,400
i'm like wow that is really wild so we

539
00:20:23,430 --> 00:20:21,200
start going up to the formation

540
00:20:24,390 --> 00:20:23,440
and what jeff did is he had an aerial

541
00:20:27,029 --> 00:20:24,400
view

542
00:20:29,750 --> 00:20:27,039
of the formation said what i want

543
00:20:32,710 --> 00:20:29,760
everybody to do is go in and measure

544
00:20:34,230 --> 00:20:32,720
the circles record all the diameters

545
00:20:35,830 --> 00:20:34,240
write them down on a sheet that he had

546
00:20:38,870 --> 00:20:35,840
made up that had a diagram

547
00:20:40,470 --> 00:20:38,880
already of the formation he says because

548
00:20:43,430 --> 00:20:40,480
we got to do this basically

549
00:20:45,270 --> 00:20:43,440
well organized so we went in i was in

550
00:20:47,830 --> 00:20:45,280
one group where we started measuring

551
00:20:49,510 --> 00:20:47,840
circles going in on one of the arms some

552
00:20:51,510 --> 00:20:49,520
of the other volunteers went and started

553
00:20:54,310 --> 00:20:51,520
measuring some of the

554
00:20:55,510 --> 00:20:54,320
other arms going in and something that

555
00:20:57,270 --> 00:20:55,520
really got me

556
00:20:58,950 --> 00:20:57,280
right off the bat was is we're starting

557
00:21:00,549 --> 00:20:58,960
to go into these circles

558
00:21:02,710 --> 00:21:00,559
a friend of mine aaron clark is very

559
00:21:04,789 --> 00:21:02,720
laid he's kind of high strung but

560
00:21:05,909 --> 00:21:04,799
he's not one to get excited over certain

561
00:21:08,230 --> 00:21:05,919
things

562
00:21:09,990 --> 00:21:08,240
well he starts arguing with the person

563
00:21:10,870 --> 00:21:10,000
next to him who's just completely laid

564
00:21:12,789 --> 00:21:10,880
back

565
00:21:15,350 --> 00:21:12,799
over how to measure a circle that's

566
00:21:17,669 --> 00:21:15,360
about four feet across

567
00:21:19,190 --> 00:21:17,679
like this is weird and i thought they

568
00:21:21,830 --> 00:21:19,200
were almost going to go to blows for a

569
00:21:23,430 --> 00:21:21,840
while arguing over the circle

570
00:21:25,029 --> 00:21:23,440
why kind of backed i said man if this

571
00:21:26,470 --> 00:21:25,039
formation is messing somebody up because

572
00:21:27,590 --> 00:21:26,480
maybe it's the formation i don't know

573
00:21:28,870 --> 00:21:27,600
what it is but

574
00:21:31,270 --> 00:21:28,880
i don't want to get involved with this

575
00:21:33,270 --> 00:21:31,280
right away i stayed back

576
00:21:34,310 --> 00:21:33,280
finally they calmed down after about 15

577
00:21:37,190 --> 00:21:34,320
minutes

578
00:21:39,430 --> 00:21:37,200
and we started measuring all the circles

579
00:21:40,870 --> 00:21:39,440
as we went in we also had compasses we

580
00:21:43,110 --> 00:21:40,880
had cell phones along with us with

581
00:21:46,070 --> 00:21:43,120
compasses and stuff

582
00:21:47,750 --> 00:21:46,080
well we got all the way into the middle

583
00:21:49,510 --> 00:21:47,760
took us i don't know how long

584
00:21:51,510 --> 00:21:49,520
and what we are trying to do is step

585
00:21:52,950 --> 00:21:51,520
over corn stocks

586
00:21:54,149 --> 00:21:52,960
as we're going and measuring these and

587
00:21:55,510 --> 00:21:54,159
the thing that you would have noted on

588
00:21:57,750 --> 00:21:55,520
there martin is

589
00:21:59,270 --> 00:21:57,760
the corn stalks were not been off flush

590
00:22:01,510 --> 00:21:59,280
of the ground

591
00:22:03,190 --> 00:22:01,520
the corn stalks were anywhere from two

592
00:22:05,830 --> 00:22:03,200
feet to about six inches above the

593
00:22:07,750 --> 00:22:05,840
ground bent over to 90 degree angle

594
00:22:10,230 --> 00:22:07,760
and some were bent not just at 90 but

595
00:22:11,990 --> 00:22:10,240
then at a second 90.

596
00:22:13,590 --> 00:22:12,000
so we're trying to step over these corn

597
00:22:16,070 --> 00:22:13,600
stalks as we're going in

598
00:22:17,909 --> 00:22:16,080
not to do damage but i'm thinking the

599
00:22:21,029 --> 00:22:17,919
whole time

600
00:22:24,630 --> 00:22:21,039
how could somebody make this

601
00:22:27,669 --> 00:22:24,640
because this formation was probably

602
00:22:29,110 --> 00:22:27,679
about 400 feet across from

603
00:22:31,830 --> 00:22:29,120
edge of one arm to the edge of the other

604
00:22:32,710 --> 00:22:31,840
arm and when i asked the farmer i said

605
00:22:36,070 --> 00:22:32,720
how much

606
00:22:38,549 --> 00:22:36,080
corn is estimated to be taken down

607
00:22:39,430 --> 00:22:38,559
not in the field but taken down of that

608
00:22:42,630 --> 00:22:39,440
pattern

609
00:22:45,590 --> 00:22:42,640
he said about five acres

610
00:22:46,630 --> 00:22:45,600
now that much corn being bent over to be

611
00:22:49,029 --> 00:22:46,640
honest with you you couldn't get enough

612
00:22:50,630 --> 00:22:49,039
alcohol in me to go out at night

613
00:22:52,630 --> 00:22:50,640
and hoax one of these things you

614
00:22:55,029 --> 00:22:52,640
couldn't do it i don't care what you

615
00:22:57,110 --> 00:22:55,039
offered me there's just no way because

616
00:22:58,789 --> 00:22:57,120
you couldn't take a board and hit a corn

617
00:22:59,990 --> 00:22:58,799
stock and kind of knock it over the way

618
00:23:01,190 --> 00:23:00,000
these were

619
00:23:03,430 --> 00:23:01,200
well when you're talking about they're

620
00:23:05,909 --> 00:23:03,440
up you know up to six inches

621
00:23:06,710 --> 00:23:05,919
and then again above knocked over it

622
00:23:08,390 --> 00:23:06,720
almost makes

623
00:23:10,630 --> 00:23:08,400
it sound like it had to be hit by

624
00:23:13,909 --> 00:23:10,640
something or you know i mean how do you

625
00:23:15,990 --> 00:23:13,919
how do you knock something over well

626
00:23:18,230 --> 00:23:16,000
it's either that or something causes it

627
00:23:21,270 --> 00:23:18,240
to cause like bend and fall over

628
00:23:23,990 --> 00:23:21,280
possibly well as we went into the center

629
00:23:25,430 --> 00:23:24,000
circle one of the things i noticed was

630
00:23:27,029 --> 00:23:25,440
the outer circle let's say may have

631
00:23:29,270 --> 00:23:27,039
started clockwise the next

632
00:23:30,310 --> 00:23:29,280
circle in went counterclockwise then

633
00:23:32,789 --> 00:23:30,320
back to clockwise

634
00:23:34,310 --> 00:23:32,799
counterclockwise once you got to the

635
00:23:37,430 --> 00:23:34,320
center circle

636
00:23:39,830 --> 00:23:37,440
you had like one row going clockwise the

637
00:23:41,430 --> 00:23:39,840
next row going counterclockwise

638
00:23:43,669 --> 00:23:41,440
alternating as you got towards the

639
00:23:45,430 --> 00:23:43,679
center then the center

640
00:23:48,549 --> 00:23:45,440
i don't know how many rows you would

641
00:23:50,950 --> 00:23:48,559
call it actually folded outward

642
00:23:52,549 --> 00:23:50,960
and laid down on top of the other ones

643
00:23:54,390 --> 00:23:52,559
so it's like the outer ones had to go

644
00:23:56,230 --> 00:23:54,400
down first with the inner ones falling

645
00:23:59,190 --> 00:23:56,240
out over

646
00:24:00,630 --> 00:23:59,200
the outer ones and then you had a center

647
00:24:03,110 --> 00:24:00,640
stalk standing right up in the middle of

648
00:24:07,350 --> 00:24:05,909
and it was just incredible to see this

649
00:24:09,909 --> 00:24:07,360
this much corn

650
00:24:13,590 --> 00:24:09,919
and from what we can tell it almost it

651
00:24:15,269 --> 00:24:13,600
had to happen basically overnight

652
00:24:16,950 --> 00:24:15,279
the only way we could tell that really

653
00:24:17,990 --> 00:24:16,960
had happened right sometime around the

654
00:24:19,590 --> 00:24:18,000
20th was

655
00:24:21,190 --> 00:24:19,600
aerial photographs that's the only

656
00:24:23,909 --> 00:24:21,200
reason we knew it had to be like a week

657
00:24:26,390 --> 00:24:23,919
or two before the 20th

658
00:24:27,510 --> 00:24:26,400
because the photographs had turned up

659
00:24:30,310 --> 00:24:27,520
the farmer

660
00:24:32,789 --> 00:24:30,320
didn't notice anything something that

661
00:24:35,190 --> 00:24:32,799
was unique about the lay of the land

662
00:24:35,990 --> 00:24:35,200
was you had the indian mounds on a

663
00:24:39,750 --> 00:24:36,000
higher

664
00:24:41,990 --> 00:24:39,760
plane you go over here's a row of trees

665
00:24:44,830 --> 00:24:42,000
to kind of hide this cornfield

666
00:24:46,149 --> 00:24:44,840
the cornfield drops down behind the

667
00:24:49,510 --> 00:24:46,159
trees

668
00:24:49,990 --> 00:24:49,520
then past the the cornfield there is a

669
00:24:53,430 --> 00:24:50,000
small

670
00:24:55,430 --> 00:24:53,440
creek that flows

671
00:24:56,470 --> 00:24:55,440
at one end of the cornfield clear on the

672
00:25:00,230 --> 00:24:56,480
far end with some high

673
00:25:01,909 --> 00:25:00,240
tension lines and jeff actually

674
00:25:03,430 --> 00:25:01,919
knew about this region and he made a

675
00:25:04,390 --> 00:25:03,440
comment i think they said about a year

676
00:25:05,830 --> 00:25:04,400
before that that

677
00:25:07,750 --> 00:25:05,840
this would be a unique area to find

678
00:25:11,029 --> 00:25:07,760
another formation

679
00:25:13,430 --> 00:25:11,039
because he looked at a formation down at

680
00:25:14,950 --> 00:25:13,440
serpent mounds and he said this had all

681
00:25:17,590 --> 00:25:14,960
the same markings that

682
00:25:19,350 --> 00:25:17,600
of the area down at serpent mounds did

683
00:25:21,350 --> 00:25:19,360
and he thought this would be another

684
00:25:23,830 --> 00:25:21,360
primary for one to pop up at down the

685
00:25:24,630 --> 00:25:23,840
road and here lo and behold about a year

686
00:25:27,510 --> 00:25:24,640
later

687
00:25:28,710 --> 00:25:27,520
one did now do you have a do you have a

688
00:25:31,990 --> 00:25:28,720
picture

689
00:25:32,870 --> 00:25:32,000
on that of that crop circle yeah i'll

690
00:25:35,430 --> 00:25:32,880
see if i can

691
00:25:35,909 --> 00:25:35,440
send you one real quick oh yeah you can

692
00:25:39,830 --> 00:25:35,919
actually

693
00:25:42,230 --> 00:25:39,840
like um

694
00:25:44,310 --> 00:25:42,240
it's a little clunky for me to teach you

695
00:25:45,990 --> 00:25:44,320
right now how to share your screen

696
00:25:47,830 --> 00:25:46,000
and so um unfortunately i didn't think

697
00:25:50,870 --> 00:25:47,840
of that ahead of time so go ahead and

698
00:25:53,909 --> 00:25:50,880
just email that to me but um

699
00:25:56,710 --> 00:25:53,919
uh so it is unusual

700
00:25:57,830 --> 00:25:56,720
it just sounds like a real a real uh

701
00:25:59,750 --> 00:25:57,840
weird

702
00:26:00,870 --> 00:25:59,760
uh one i don't know what i've always

703
00:26:03,190 --> 00:26:00,880
been on the fence about

704
00:26:03,990 --> 00:26:03,200
crop circles whether you know they're

705
00:26:07,750 --> 00:26:04,000
really

706
00:26:08,310 --> 00:26:07,760
related to you the ufo well phenomena or

707
00:26:10,149 --> 00:26:08,320
not

708
00:26:12,630 --> 00:26:10,159
you brought up an interesting fact right

709
00:26:16,070 --> 00:26:12,640
there see when we went down

710
00:26:17,750 --> 00:26:16,080
we did it as not a ufo but investigating

711
00:26:20,789 --> 00:26:17,760
a crop circle

712
00:26:22,870 --> 00:26:20,799
what was ironic a little ironic side

713
00:26:26,070 --> 00:26:22,880
note to the whole story was

714
00:26:28,310 --> 00:26:26,080
we spent the whole day inside um

715
00:26:30,230 --> 00:26:28,320
measuring doing all the stuff like that

716
00:26:32,950 --> 00:26:30,240
a couple of compasses started acting up

717
00:26:34,789 --> 00:26:32,960
in one of the circles by the way

718
00:26:36,470 --> 00:26:34,799
and there was no power lines or nothing

719
00:26:38,149 --> 00:26:36,480
next to it but it just started acting up

720
00:26:39,830 --> 00:26:38,159
and people also had to reboot their cell

721
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:39,840
phones

722
00:26:44,950 --> 00:26:41,410
the um

723
00:26:53,430 --> 00:26:49,909
the samples were taken of the corn

724
00:26:55,029 --> 00:26:53,440
and 11 dr levingood did the examination

725
00:26:58,149 --> 00:26:55,039
on the corn and said it looked like the

726
00:27:01,029 --> 00:26:58,159
stalks had blown out from the inside

727
00:27:02,789 --> 00:27:01,039
almost like uh mike like steam had made

728
00:27:05,510 --> 00:27:02,799
him pop out

729
00:27:07,350 --> 00:27:05,520
like maybe they'd been superheated and

730
00:27:07,669 --> 00:27:07,360
one of the theories was is maybe that's

731
00:27:11,430 --> 00:27:07,679
what

732
00:27:12,630 --> 00:27:11,440
caused the cr the formation kind of fall

733
00:27:15,590 --> 00:27:12,640
over

734
00:27:16,470 --> 00:27:15,600
someone wrote microwave right like

735
00:27:21,110 --> 00:27:16,480
microwaves

736
00:27:23,269 --> 00:27:21,120
yeah there's um the blt research

737
00:27:24,230 --> 00:27:23,279
on nancy i can't think of her last name

738
00:27:27,269 --> 00:27:24,240
right now

739
00:27:31,190 --> 00:27:27,279
um with rocker rockefeller's

740
00:27:33,510 --> 00:27:31,200
funding it's still still going um they

741
00:27:34,870 --> 00:27:33,520
they are in massachusetts did they

742
00:27:35,830 --> 00:27:34,880
contact you about that when that

743
00:27:38,950 --> 00:27:35,840
happened

744
00:27:41,110 --> 00:27:38,960
no they didn't um but i know know who

745
00:27:43,430 --> 00:27:41,120
you're talking about

746
00:27:45,269 --> 00:27:43,440
and jeff i let jeff handle everything on

747
00:27:46,630 --> 00:27:45,279
that i just stayed back as like the fly

748
00:27:47,750 --> 00:27:46,640
on the wall and just wanted to really

749
00:27:50,870 --> 00:27:47,760
observe things

750
00:27:52,549 --> 00:27:50,880
yeah because we had some members of our

751
00:27:55,029 --> 00:27:52,559
mufon organization this is

752
00:27:56,710 --> 00:27:55,039
by the way before i was state director

753
00:27:57,990 --> 00:27:56,720
they showed up and said they want told

754
00:28:01,190 --> 00:27:58,000
the farmer they went in

755
00:28:03,750 --> 00:28:01,200
to do a ufo investigation and he said

756
00:28:05,909 --> 00:28:03,760
there was no ufo here

757
00:28:07,590 --> 00:28:05,919
and he wouldn't let him in and they

758
00:28:09,110 --> 00:28:07,600
looked down in the field and saw me out

759
00:28:12,470 --> 00:28:09,120
there working and i said i'm out here

760
00:28:16,630 --> 00:28:15,350
yeah yeah so you know there is crossover

761
00:28:18,710 --> 00:28:16,640
there are people who have

762
00:28:19,830 --> 00:28:18,720
claimed they've seen orbs you know

763
00:28:23,269 --> 00:28:19,840
flyover

764
00:28:25,029 --> 00:28:23,279
um there are uh you know i

765
00:28:27,190 --> 00:28:25,039
i know there's a large percentage of

766
00:28:28,870 --> 00:28:27,200
crop circles that are hoaxed

767
00:28:30,310 --> 00:28:28,880
that are people out there with you know

768
00:28:32,710 --> 00:28:30,320
boards on their feet and

769
00:28:34,149 --> 00:28:32,720
and doing it and uh and and doing

770
00:28:36,710 --> 00:28:34,159
amazing crop circles

771
00:28:37,590 --> 00:28:36,720
but there are some that there aren't

772
00:28:40,470 --> 00:28:37,600
answers for

773
00:28:41,830 --> 00:28:40,480
that um that there are you know effects

774
00:28:44,789 --> 00:28:41,840
to the soil

775
00:28:46,870 --> 00:28:44,799
as well as the um the the you said the

776
00:28:49,990 --> 00:28:46,880
stocks the court stocks but as well

777
00:28:52,070 --> 00:28:50,000
as uh the wheat um you know wherever

778
00:28:53,350 --> 00:28:52,080
they're at there seems to be something

779
00:28:55,830 --> 00:28:53,360
going on

780
00:28:56,789 --> 00:28:55,840
um but you know there is a there is a

781
00:28:59,110 --> 00:28:56,799
video

782
00:29:00,310 --> 00:28:59,120
um that was circling around circulating

783
00:29:02,870 --> 00:29:00,320
around of

784
00:29:04,310 --> 00:29:02,880
like an orb going over a field and then

785
00:29:05,909 --> 00:29:04,320
like the next day there was a

786
00:29:07,990 --> 00:29:05,919
a crop circle there you know whether

787
00:29:10,789 --> 00:29:08,000
that had anything to do

788
00:29:13,510 --> 00:29:10,799
one had to do with the other or not um i

789
00:29:17,750 --> 00:29:13,520
have no idea it's uh

790
00:29:20,710 --> 00:29:17,760
it's interesting so um

791
00:29:22,789 --> 00:29:20,720
i will once you send me that picture i

792
00:29:25,110 --> 00:29:22,799
will pop that up on the screen

793
00:29:27,190 --> 00:29:25,120
but we can move uh move forward from

794
00:29:28,789 --> 00:29:27,200
that and uh

795
00:29:30,470 --> 00:29:28,799
next i wanted to talk to you about when

796
00:29:32,549 --> 00:29:30,480
i listened to one of your podcasts which

797
00:29:34,149 --> 00:29:32,559
are really it's really good by the way

798
00:29:36,230 --> 00:29:34,159
and uh i don't know how you do a

799
00:29:37,590 --> 00:29:36,240
55-minute monologue but you do a pretty

800
00:29:40,789 --> 00:29:37,600
good job well

801
00:29:42,230 --> 00:29:40,799
i i do it because over the years um

802
00:29:44,870 --> 00:29:42,240
one of the things i branched out into

803
00:29:47,590 --> 00:29:44,880
martin was i did a lot of presentations

804
00:29:49,669 --> 00:29:47,600
around the state of ohio and other areas

805
00:29:51,830 --> 00:29:49,679
so it is i put together power points but

806
00:29:54,710 --> 00:29:51,840
i don't like to rely on the powerpoint

807
00:29:56,789 --> 00:29:54,720
i kind of use them along with like it's

808
00:29:58,549 --> 00:29:56,799
basically a monologue

809
00:30:00,070 --> 00:29:58,559
where i kind of narrate people and kind

810
00:30:03,190 --> 00:30:00,080
of guide them through the pictures and

811
00:30:05,190 --> 00:30:03,200
what really happened during these events

812
00:30:06,870 --> 00:30:05,200
and that's where a lot of it comes from

813
00:30:08,470 --> 00:30:06,880
and these programs i run are probably

814
00:30:09,510 --> 00:30:08,480
about an hour and a half on an average

815
00:30:11,029 --> 00:30:09,520
long so it's

816
00:30:12,710 --> 00:30:11,039
it works out to make it easy for the

817
00:30:15,750 --> 00:30:12,720
podcast yeah

818
00:30:17,350 --> 00:30:15,760
yeah um yeah so if you send me that i'll

819
00:30:19,350 --> 00:30:17,360
pop it up but for now um

820
00:30:20,870 --> 00:30:19,360
i thought we could move on and uh

821
00:30:23,269 --> 00:30:20,880
stephen has a question

822
00:30:24,870 --> 00:30:23,279
in the chat room do you know anything

823
00:30:28,789 --> 00:30:24,880
about the

824
00:30:32,149 --> 00:30:28,799
trumbull county case yeah

825
00:30:33,590 --> 00:30:32,159
trumbull county goes back um

826
00:30:35,350 --> 00:30:33,600
trying to remember the exact date it has

827
00:30:37,430 --> 00:30:35,360
to go back into the 1990s is an

828
00:30:40,630 --> 00:30:37,440
interesting case where

829
00:30:41,990 --> 00:30:40,640
uh it has completely come across by

830
00:30:43,350 --> 00:30:42,000
accident

831
00:30:45,350 --> 00:30:43,360
there's a gentleman back then by the

832
00:30:47,990 --> 00:30:45,360
name of kenny young

833
00:30:50,149 --> 00:30:48,000
who happened to be researching a

834
00:30:53,350 --> 00:30:50,159
reported creche

835
00:30:56,389 --> 00:30:53,360
down around the dayton area of a ufo

836
00:30:57,269 --> 00:30:56,399
so he calls up he has to be connected

837
00:31:02,070 --> 00:30:57,279
with

838
00:31:04,710 --> 00:31:02,080
liberty police liberty uh police

839
00:31:05,509 --> 00:31:04,720
and back then at that time we didn't

840
00:31:08,070 --> 00:31:05,519
have google

841
00:31:09,350 --> 00:31:08,080
like we do now he called directory

842
00:31:12,389 --> 00:31:09,360
assistants

843
00:31:14,389 --> 00:31:12,399
him with the police department he was

844
00:31:16,070 --> 00:31:14,399
looking for down by dayton

845
00:31:17,430 --> 00:31:16,080
they actually connected him with liberty

846
00:31:19,350 --> 00:31:17,440
township

847
00:31:21,669 --> 00:31:19,360
which is over by youngstown which is

848
00:31:23,029 --> 00:31:21,679
trumbull county

849
00:31:25,190 --> 00:31:23,039
he got put on the phone with the

850
00:31:26,950 --> 00:31:25,200
dispatcher and said i'd like to talk to

851
00:31:29,509 --> 00:31:26,960
you about the ufo case that

852
00:31:30,789 --> 00:31:29,519
ufo event had happened here and they

853
00:31:31,990 --> 00:31:30,799
mentioned it was only like a couple

854
00:31:33,669 --> 00:31:32,000
years ago

855
00:31:35,909 --> 00:31:33,679
well the one he was researching was a

856
00:31:37,750 --> 00:31:35,919
completely different date

857
00:31:39,669 --> 00:31:37,760
well he played it by ear and said okay

858
00:31:41,430 --> 00:31:39,679
let's roll with it

859
00:31:43,029 --> 00:31:41,440
and he just started letting them offer

860
00:31:44,149 --> 00:31:43,039
up all their information and found out

861
00:31:47,750 --> 00:31:44,159
he had a totally

862
00:31:49,590 --> 00:31:47,760
separate event in which

863
00:31:52,630 --> 00:31:49,600
he kept searching out searching out

864
00:31:56,470 --> 00:31:52,640
searching out and reportedly he was

865
00:31:58,950 --> 00:31:56,480
mailed deny a copy of the 911 tapes from

866
00:32:01,830 --> 00:31:58,960
that those days

867
00:32:03,830 --> 00:32:01,840
of which it was kind of like fragmented

868
00:32:05,830 --> 00:32:03,840
but he got the 911 tapes and they're

869
00:32:08,870 --> 00:32:05,840
available by the way on the internet

870
00:32:11,909 --> 00:32:08,880
uh that your listeners can google

871
00:32:13,830 --> 00:32:11,919
on youtube they can pull these up

872
00:32:16,070 --> 00:32:13,840
and you can hear if you start the

873
00:32:19,350 --> 00:32:16,080
beginning the officers

874
00:32:21,110 --> 00:32:19,360
being told to respond um to

875
00:32:22,549 --> 00:32:21,120
an event where a witness reported seeing

876
00:32:23,990 --> 00:32:22,559
ufo

877
00:32:25,830 --> 00:32:24,000
and i actually happened to be director

878
00:32:28,470 --> 00:32:25,840
of a university

879
00:32:29,830 --> 00:32:28,480
not that far from where it happened at

880
00:32:33,990 --> 00:32:29,840
um

881
00:32:36,070 --> 00:32:34,000
the policeman's first name was toby

882
00:32:38,070 --> 00:32:36,080
well toby and i can't remember his last

883
00:32:42,710 --> 00:32:38,080
name i apologize for that

884
00:32:44,870 --> 00:32:42,720
went out to investigate and he saw

885
00:32:47,590 --> 00:32:44,880
an object out in the region where he was

886
00:32:50,870 --> 00:32:49,269
there was a question about the time

887
00:32:52,230 --> 00:32:50,880
frame that this really happened at

888
00:32:55,430 --> 00:32:52,240
because

889
00:32:57,350 --> 00:32:55,440
the tapes were wrapped in newspaper and

890
00:32:59,430 --> 00:32:57,360
the person who wrapped them up played

891
00:33:01,590 --> 00:32:59,440
this game back then that

892
00:33:03,750 --> 00:33:01,600
uh they would put like little cryptic

893
00:33:04,870 --> 00:33:03,760
messages together out of like newspaper

894
00:33:09,269 --> 00:33:04,880
clippings

895
00:33:11,190 --> 00:33:09,279
almost like uh little mystery things

896
00:33:12,950 --> 00:33:11,200
well from the dates and the newspapers

897
00:33:14,789 --> 00:33:12,960
is when they approximated when the tapes

898
00:33:18,310 --> 00:33:14,799
were made

899
00:33:19,990 --> 00:33:18,320
but one of the questions that came up is

900
00:33:21,590 --> 00:33:20,000
individuals were talking about going

901
00:33:23,430 --> 00:33:21,600
around in shorts but yet it was

902
00:33:25,350 --> 00:33:23,440
supposedly cold out at that time so

903
00:33:26,470 --> 00:33:25,360
there's there's questions on the exact

904
00:33:28,870 --> 00:33:26,480
date

905
00:33:30,549 --> 00:33:28,880
but he got out there and to kind of make

906
00:33:34,070 --> 00:33:30,559
a long story short

907
00:33:37,029 --> 00:33:34,080
his car died his cruiser died

908
00:33:37,990 --> 00:33:37,039
it stopped he couldn't restart it the

909
00:33:41,350 --> 00:33:38,000
dispatcher

910
00:33:41,909 --> 00:33:41,360
panicked because she lost contact with

911
00:33:43,509 --> 00:33:41,919
him

912
00:33:45,830 --> 00:33:43,519
she's like where's he at where is he at

913
00:33:48,549 --> 00:33:45,840
where's he at that's not like him

914
00:33:50,789 --> 00:33:48,559
an object comes out and passes directly

915
00:33:52,389 --> 00:33:50,799
over his cruiser

916
00:33:54,710 --> 00:33:52,399
of which he thought about actually

917
00:33:56,230 --> 00:33:54,720
shooting at it now one thing i'd always

918
00:33:57,509 --> 00:33:56,240
want to tell your listeners is if you

919
00:33:58,230 --> 00:33:57,519
see something passing over your head

920
00:34:01,509 --> 00:33:58,240
like that

921
00:34:04,310 --> 00:34:01,519
don't shoot it may not be a good idea no

922
00:34:06,789 --> 00:34:04,320
not so good no but he didn't uh the

923
00:34:08,629 --> 00:34:06,799
object passed over once it passed over

924
00:34:10,310 --> 00:34:08,639
he finally regained its his senses a

925
00:34:13,669 --> 00:34:10,320
little bit started the cruiser back

926
00:34:15,829 --> 00:34:13,679
up he was able to contact dispatch

927
00:34:17,109 --> 00:34:15,839
and tell him that hey you know something

928
00:34:18,950 --> 00:34:17,119
happened

929
00:34:20,550 --> 00:34:18,960
he finally got his senses back but over

930
00:34:23,510 --> 00:34:20,560
that same night you had a

931
00:34:25,829 --> 00:34:23,520
number of different calls coming in from

932
00:34:27,589 --> 00:34:25,839
cruisers all over the place

933
00:34:29,589 --> 00:34:27,599
and you could see when you listen to

934
00:34:31,510 --> 00:34:29,599
these tapes

935
00:34:33,510 --> 00:34:31,520
that they start out joking the

936
00:34:36,389 --> 00:34:33,520
dispatchers joking making stokes

937
00:34:37,829 --> 00:34:36,399
jokes about star trek uh spock is going

938
00:34:39,829 --> 00:34:37,839
to be around here

939
00:34:41,430 --> 00:34:39,839
but as they're getting more phone calls

940
00:34:43,030 --> 00:34:41,440
from local people

941
00:34:44,550 --> 00:34:43,040
and then she talks to her commander you

942
00:34:46,149 --> 00:34:44,560
can see the situation's getting much

943
00:34:48,069 --> 00:34:46,159
more serious

944
00:34:50,230 --> 00:34:48,079
news agencies starting the local news

945
00:34:53,589 --> 00:34:50,240
channel starts contacting them

946
00:34:55,750 --> 00:34:53,599
the questioning about things and

947
00:34:57,750 --> 00:34:55,760
different other officers around the

948
00:34:59,910 --> 00:34:57,760
region start reporting seeing

949
00:35:02,069 --> 00:34:59,920
also ufos now some of it could be a

950
00:35:05,990 --> 00:35:02,079
little mass hysteria

951
00:35:09,190 --> 00:35:06,000
but it was a real interesting sighting

952
00:35:12,390 --> 00:35:09,200
so it's a great story behind that one

953
00:35:13,750 --> 00:35:12,400
um and i can't remember the exact date

954
00:35:17,190 --> 00:35:13,760
to give your listeners

955
00:35:20,230 --> 00:35:17,200
1994 1794 yeah so

956
00:35:23,109 --> 00:35:20,240
posted up there yeah and the officer by

957
00:35:25,430 --> 00:35:23,119
the way is still on duty over there

958
00:35:28,230 --> 00:35:25,440
he actually had bubble gum machines in

959
00:35:31,109 --> 00:35:28,240
my lobby i found out were his

960
00:35:32,630 --> 00:35:31,119
he did as a side thing but he's still

961
00:35:33,349 --> 00:35:32,640
over there and i think he's a captain

962
00:35:35,109 --> 00:35:33,359
now

963
00:35:37,910 --> 00:35:35,119
but he said it slowed his career down

964
00:35:39,910 --> 00:35:37,920
once he reported that whole thing

965
00:35:41,990 --> 00:35:39,920
but that whole story came up because

966
00:35:43,750 --> 00:35:42,000
kenny young stumbled across that whole

967
00:35:45,670 --> 00:35:43,760
thing by accident

968
00:35:47,270 --> 00:35:45,680
and then he got a hold of 911 tapes i

969
00:35:50,950 --> 00:35:47,280
think which took about two years to

970
00:35:53,910 --> 00:35:50,960
eventually track all the stuff down

971
00:35:55,430 --> 00:35:53,920
well interesting going back to earlier

972
00:35:56,310 --> 00:35:55,440
you were talking i don't know if you can

973
00:35:58,630 --> 00:35:56,320
see these

974
00:35:59,349 --> 00:35:58,640
pop up this question just popped up can

975
00:36:02,550 --> 00:35:59,359
you see it

976
00:36:03,589 --> 00:36:02,560
on the screen yes yeah so um bobby you

977
00:36:05,190 --> 00:36:03,599
want to know

978
00:36:07,829 --> 00:36:05,200
uh going back to what you're talking

979
00:36:10,550 --> 00:36:07,839
about when it comes to the ham radios

980
00:36:10,950 --> 00:36:10,560
um do you have communication receivers

981
00:36:13,829 --> 00:36:10,960
do

982
00:36:15,750 --> 00:36:13,839
sometimes in real time listen to ham

983
00:36:17,910 --> 00:36:15,760
radio bands for anything

984
00:36:19,430 --> 00:36:17,920
concerning ufos has that has that ever

985
00:36:21,910 --> 00:36:19,440
been crossed

986
00:36:23,510 --> 00:36:21,920
no not in real time but i do have the

987
00:36:26,470 --> 00:36:23,520
ability to pull up

988
00:36:28,150 --> 00:36:26,480
different frequencies on there but i

989
00:36:29,430 --> 00:36:28,160
haven't caught anything in real time

990
00:36:32,870 --> 00:36:29,440
were they talking about

991
00:36:36,630 --> 00:36:32,880
ufos what we happen to do is um

992
00:36:39,510 --> 00:36:36,640
on a few cases we reached out to a

993
00:36:39,990 --> 00:36:39,520
local amateur radio group down in

994
00:36:42,390 --> 00:36:40,000
southern

995
00:36:44,150 --> 00:36:42,400
ohio and they're the ones that these

996
00:36:45,270 --> 00:36:44,160
guys basically set back and track

997
00:36:48,950 --> 00:36:45,280
communications

998
00:36:50,470 --> 00:36:48,960
like 24 7 of what's going on

999
00:36:53,430 --> 00:36:50,480
and they were the ones that helped us

1000
00:36:56,470 --> 00:36:53,440
out when we did research on a few cases

1001
00:36:59,670 --> 00:36:56,480
they even provided the call signs

1002
00:37:03,430 --> 00:36:59,680
for the military aircraft in the region

1003
00:37:06,630 --> 00:37:03,440
of which were able to contact toledo

1004
00:37:07,910 --> 00:37:06,640
uh toledo national uh guard

1005
00:37:09,829 --> 00:37:07,920
and they verified that they were

1006
00:37:11,670 --> 00:37:09,839
conducting exercises down there and even

1007
00:37:14,390 --> 00:37:11,680
confirmed the call signs

1008
00:37:17,030 --> 00:37:14,400
and i did find some other resources out

1009
00:37:20,150 --> 00:37:17,040
there to confirm the same thing

1010
00:37:20,630 --> 00:37:20,160
but it was just something we stumbled

1011
00:37:22,470 --> 00:37:20,640
upon

1012
00:37:25,589 --> 00:37:22,480
is just contacting the local amateur

1013
00:37:29,109 --> 00:37:25,599
radio group which does that already

1014
00:37:31,349 --> 00:37:29,119
interesting um now i want to

1015
00:37:32,870 --> 00:37:31,359
take a little sidestep here because when

1016
00:37:35,750 --> 00:37:32,880
i was listening to

1017
00:37:36,630 --> 00:37:35,760
your podcast you were talking about the

1018
00:37:39,829 --> 00:37:36,640
jetpack

1019
00:37:42,630 --> 00:37:39,839
case i kept hearing about i'm gonna pull

1020
00:37:43,990 --> 00:37:42,640
up this uh this is actually in la

1021
00:37:45,990 --> 00:37:44,000
one of them was i don't know if they

1022
00:37:48,950 --> 00:37:46,000
were all out there there could have been

1023
00:37:50,069 --> 00:37:48,960
some copycats uh this is the image it

1024
00:37:52,390 --> 00:37:50,079
looks

1025
00:37:53,829 --> 00:37:52,400
you know it does uh for those of you on

1026
00:37:54,790 --> 00:37:53,839
facebook i can put this in the show

1027
00:37:58,310 --> 00:37:54,800
notes

1028
00:38:02,390 --> 00:37:58,320
but um it it looks a little bit

1029
00:38:05,829 --> 00:38:02,400
top-heavy but it looks like it could be

1030
00:38:08,790 --> 00:38:05,839
a humanoid um looking type of

1031
00:38:10,069 --> 00:38:08,800
thing so can you get into uh i know

1032
00:38:11,750 --> 00:38:10,079
you've done some work on this looking

1033
00:38:14,550 --> 00:38:11,760
into it

1034
00:38:16,630 --> 00:38:14,560
well i like to pull up some unique

1035
00:38:18,950 --> 00:38:16,640
things to research at times and

1036
00:38:21,829 --> 00:38:18,960
i stumbled across the story going back

1037
00:38:25,349 --> 00:38:21,839
to the middle of october

1038
00:38:28,150 --> 00:38:25,359
about what appeared to be a jet pack

1039
00:38:29,750 --> 00:38:28,160
flying close to lax now i'm thinking who

1040
00:38:32,150 --> 00:38:29,760
in their right mind first of all

1041
00:38:33,430 --> 00:38:32,160
would be flying a jet pack through air

1042
00:38:35,430 --> 00:38:33,440
air lanes

1043
00:38:36,710 --> 00:38:35,440
near lax because you could end up like a

1044
00:38:40,390 --> 00:38:36,720
bug in a windshield

1045
00:38:43,589 --> 00:38:40,400
of a commercial airliner out there but

1046
00:38:44,310 --> 00:38:43,599
individuals saw this from a airliner

1047
00:38:47,510 --> 00:38:44,320
approaching

1048
00:38:51,030 --> 00:38:47,520
lax that appeared that there was a

1049
00:38:54,630 --> 00:38:51,040
individual flying a jet pack at about

1050
00:38:56,150 --> 00:38:54,640
6 000 feet they said they could see it

1051
00:38:57,589 --> 00:38:56,160
off the wing of the aircraft as they're

1052
00:39:00,790 --> 00:38:57,599
going in

1053
00:39:01,750 --> 00:39:00,800
they also radioed out to other aircraft

1054
00:39:04,230 --> 00:39:01,760
in the region

1055
00:39:06,630 --> 00:39:04,240
and a second aircraft in the same region

1056
00:39:08,150 --> 00:39:06,640
also saw the same thing

1057
00:39:11,349 --> 00:39:08,160
and they said it appeared to be like a

1058
00:39:13,030 --> 00:39:11,359
humanoid flying a jet pack

1059
00:39:15,030 --> 00:39:13,040
but one of the first things i thought

1060
00:39:15,990 --> 00:39:15,040
about was you know the old james bond

1061
00:39:17,990 --> 00:39:16,000
movie

1062
00:39:19,589 --> 00:39:18,000
where the guy has this jet pack on his

1063
00:39:22,150 --> 00:39:19,599
back and he's flying around but

1064
00:39:24,630 --> 00:39:22,160
those things only lasted like about a

1065
00:39:27,270 --> 00:39:24,640
minute maybe at the most

1066
00:39:28,790 --> 00:39:27,280
they didn't have it i think that's all i

1067
00:39:30,390 --> 00:39:28,800
don't think they can last

1068
00:39:32,790 --> 00:39:30,400
long enough to get up to six thousand

1069
00:39:36,710 --> 00:39:32,800
feet can they no

1070
00:39:39,829 --> 00:39:36,720
advance that much ah but not that type

1071
00:39:42,390 --> 00:39:39,839
there is a guy in dubai that

1072
00:39:43,030 --> 00:39:42,400
created a jet pack that this thing has

1073
00:39:44,790 --> 00:39:43,040
almost like

1074
00:39:46,069 --> 00:39:44,800
wings on it he can take off from the

1075
00:39:50,390 --> 00:39:46,079
ground

1076
00:39:53,430 --> 00:39:50,400
he can get up to five six thousand feet

1077
00:39:57,109 --> 00:39:53,440
and he was also seen flying in airplanes

1078
00:39:57,670 --> 00:39:57,119
in dubai there is a great video where

1079
00:39:59,910 --> 00:39:57,680
they're doing

1080
00:40:01,670 --> 00:39:59,920
some advertisement where here's this

1081
00:40:03,510 --> 00:40:01,680
commercial airliner coming in and you

1082
00:40:05,349 --> 00:40:03,520
see this guy out flying like

1083
00:40:07,910 --> 00:40:05,359
his arm stretched out behind him he's

1084
00:40:10,069 --> 00:40:07,920
flying like almost like a superhero

1085
00:40:11,910 --> 00:40:10,079
and he's got this jetpack on and he's

1086
00:40:13,750 --> 00:40:11,920
going i think he said roughly about 100

1087
00:40:16,790 --> 00:40:13,760
miles an hour

1088
00:40:18,710 --> 00:40:16,800
at 6 000 feet and they didn't basically

1089
00:40:21,829 --> 00:40:18,720
glide to a degree because of these

1090
00:40:24,710 --> 00:40:21,839
wings that's out there i mean this was

1091
00:40:26,230 --> 00:40:24,720
wild and i'm thinking okay what's now

1092
00:40:27,349 --> 00:40:26,240
could this guy bring this thing into the

1093
00:40:29,510 --> 00:40:27,359
u.s

1094
00:40:31,270 --> 00:40:29,520
and be doing some stunt out in

1095
00:40:32,390 --> 00:40:31,280
california not that they would ever do

1096
00:40:35,750 --> 00:40:32,400
anything

1097
00:40:38,470 --> 00:40:35,760
crazy like that in california but could

1098
00:40:39,589 --> 00:40:38,480
could a guy be doing something like that

1099
00:40:43,349 --> 00:40:39,599
well there was a second

1100
00:40:46,870 --> 00:40:43,359
sighting about a week or so later

1101
00:40:48,630 --> 00:40:46,880
and it was serious enough that the fbi

1102
00:40:50,390 --> 00:40:48,640
and the fa and other groups were looking

1103
00:40:51,990 --> 00:40:50,400
into it they weren't

1104
00:40:53,990 --> 00:40:52,000
just kind of blowing it away saying no

1105
00:40:55,030 --> 00:40:54,000
this is a hoax

1106
00:40:56,790 --> 00:40:55,040
they thought there was enough

1107
00:40:58,550 --> 00:40:56,800
information credible information here

1108
00:41:01,109 --> 00:40:58,560
that somebody may have been performing

1109
00:41:03,030 --> 00:41:01,119
something like this out there

1110
00:41:04,150 --> 00:41:03,040
now i heard a story that couldn't be

1111
00:41:05,910 --> 00:41:04,160
confirmed that

1112
00:41:07,589 --> 00:41:05,920
somebody was caught out there doing

1113
00:41:10,630 --> 00:41:07,599
something like that

1114
00:41:12,230 --> 00:41:10,640
but the guy that does it in dubai it was

1115
00:41:15,910 --> 00:41:12,240
only a few weeks ago he died

1116
00:41:18,630 --> 00:41:15,920
doing a stunt using that jet pack

1117
00:41:20,390 --> 00:41:18,640
wow so when i saw this one pop up the

1118
00:41:23,349 --> 00:41:20,400
picture i sent to you

1119
00:41:25,270 --> 00:41:23,359
this one appears to be more like the guy

1120
00:41:26,309 --> 00:41:25,280
with the big jet pack on the back but

1121
00:41:28,710 --> 00:41:26,319
like you say it's it's

1122
00:41:31,349 --> 00:41:28,720
it's kind of semi-humanoid looking but

1123
00:41:33,589 --> 00:41:31,359
the head is way too big looking

1124
00:41:34,630 --> 00:41:33,599
and when you look at the video of it it

1125
00:41:36,710 --> 00:41:34,640
almost looks like

1126
00:41:37,829 --> 00:41:36,720
the the lower part is like lego type

1127
00:41:40,150 --> 00:41:37,839
appendages

1128
00:41:41,510 --> 00:41:40,160
that you can kind of see them moving but

1129
00:41:41,750 --> 00:41:41,520
the question i would have though martin

1130
00:41:44,470 --> 00:41:41,760
is

1131
00:41:45,990 --> 00:41:44,480
the way that i saw these things moving

1132
00:41:47,270 --> 00:41:46,000
could it be something like a balloon

1133
00:41:49,030 --> 00:41:47,280
that somebody created some

1134
00:41:50,870 --> 00:41:49,040
sort of a balloon and put it up there

1135
00:41:52,550 --> 00:41:50,880
and launched it and the thing is

1136
00:41:54,550 --> 00:41:52,560
floating around

1137
00:41:56,230 --> 00:41:54,560
just to maybe get attention or something

1138
00:41:58,230 --> 00:41:56,240
like that yeah

1139
00:41:59,349 --> 00:41:58,240
because the thing that they didn't have

1140
00:42:00,829 --> 00:41:59,359
is they didn't have number

1141
00:42:03,270 --> 00:42:00,839
first of all enough information to

1142
00:42:04,710 --> 00:42:03,280
really make out a whole lot about this

1143
00:42:07,829 --> 00:42:04,720
case

1144
00:42:10,150 --> 00:42:07,839
but the pilot said he looked out his

1145
00:42:11,670 --> 00:42:10,160
window and saw this as he filmed it

1146
00:42:13,190 --> 00:42:11,680
but he didn't say if the object was

1147
00:42:15,430 --> 00:42:13,200
moving

1148
00:42:16,790 --> 00:42:15,440
yeah so you just don't know whether it's

1149
00:42:18,150 --> 00:42:16,800
stationary and the movement you're

1150
00:42:18,950 --> 00:42:18,160
seeing in the video is all because of

1151
00:42:22,390 --> 00:42:18,960
the jet

1152
00:42:24,630 --> 00:42:22,400
going forward yeah um

1153
00:42:25,910 --> 00:42:24,640
when they report something like that i

1154
00:42:29,589 --> 00:42:25,920
mean do they ever

1155
00:42:32,150 --> 00:42:29,599
when it's such a hazard um

1156
00:42:33,510 --> 00:42:32,160
you know that's that's a pretty big deal

1157
00:42:35,510 --> 00:42:33,520
especially when you're talking

1158
00:42:37,430 --> 00:42:35,520
in in jet lanes and things like that

1159
00:42:40,150 --> 00:42:37,440
well it isn't it was not that far

1160
00:42:41,829 --> 00:42:40,160
from lax it was only a few miles out

1161
00:42:44,309 --> 00:42:41,839
from lax

1162
00:42:45,829 --> 00:42:44,319
at one point so i mean that could be

1163
00:42:47,670 --> 00:42:45,839
scary

1164
00:42:50,309 --> 00:42:47,680
and you mentioned the drones earlier i

1165
00:42:52,790 --> 00:42:50,319
mean we've had drones flying close to

1166
00:42:54,550 --> 00:42:52,800
our airports up here

1167
00:42:56,790 --> 00:42:54,560
now you've got to worry about somebody

1168
00:42:59,589 --> 00:42:56,800
potentially flying a jet pack for some

1169
00:43:03,109 --> 00:42:59,599
reason out there doing the same thing

1170
00:43:06,150 --> 00:43:03,119
yeah no i had no idea that they

1171
00:43:08,150 --> 00:43:06,160
advanced in technology enough to hit

1172
00:43:10,710 --> 00:43:08,160
that type of altitude

1173
00:43:11,270 --> 00:43:10,720
it's in longevity you want to check that

1174
00:43:14,550 --> 00:43:11,280
out

1175
00:43:16,550 --> 00:43:14,560
because the guy was in dubai and he must

1176
00:43:17,910 --> 00:43:16,560
had some major money behind to develop

1177
00:43:19,190 --> 00:43:17,920
this thing

1178
00:43:21,109 --> 00:43:19,200
but they showed him going from the

1179
00:43:22,870 --> 00:43:21,119
ground up and again i always when i see

1180
00:43:25,190 --> 00:43:22,880
videos i always go into videos on

1181
00:43:27,990 --> 00:43:25,200
youtube and places with

1182
00:43:29,349 --> 00:43:28,000
a five pound bag of salt sometimes uh

1183
00:43:31,750 --> 00:43:29,359
you know you have to

1184
00:43:33,829 --> 00:43:31,760
yeah but this guy everything i could

1185
00:43:36,950 --> 00:43:33,839
find he was very credible

1186
00:43:37,589 --> 00:43:36,960
and it took him like 40 seconds to a

1187
00:43:39,349 --> 00:43:37,599
minute

1188
00:43:41,670 --> 00:43:39,359
to get up to i think it was like six

1189
00:43:43,270 --> 00:43:41,680
thousand five six thousand feet

1190
00:43:45,030 --> 00:43:43,280
this thing really moved once it got

1191
00:43:47,349 --> 00:43:45,040
started going yeah

1192
00:43:48,870 --> 00:43:47,359
and he only had it wasn't like a minute

1193
00:43:51,430 --> 00:43:48,880
he did have a much longer time

1194
00:43:52,710 --> 00:43:51,440
frame than that but it wasn't indefinite

1195
00:43:53,670 --> 00:43:52,720
like you'd think of a plane flying

1196
00:43:56,870 --> 00:43:53,680
around

1197
00:43:58,870 --> 00:43:56,880
yeah yeah well i tell you what i

1198
00:44:02,550 --> 00:43:58,880
wouldn't put myself in one of those for

1199
00:44:05,190 --> 00:44:02,560
all the money in the world no no way

1200
00:44:07,109 --> 00:44:05,200
no way at all not a fan of heights

1201
00:44:08,630 --> 00:44:07,119
myself well first of all i don't know if

1202
00:44:13,589 --> 00:44:08,640
i could lift my body weight

1203
00:44:16,950 --> 00:44:13,599
to begin with that could be a problem

1204
00:44:17,910 --> 00:44:16,960
um so let's let's uh go back um into the

1205
00:44:19,990 --> 00:44:17,920
great state of

1206
00:44:22,630 --> 00:44:20,000
ohio i have a friend from there i was

1207
00:44:25,190 --> 00:44:22,640
hoping she was listening tonight

1208
00:44:26,230 --> 00:44:25,200
and i there's like we talked about

1209
00:44:29,430 --> 00:44:26,240
earlier there's uh

1210
00:44:31,589 --> 00:44:29,440
right um right field now right patterson

1211
00:44:33,910 --> 00:44:31,599
air force base that has quite the

1212
00:44:36,309 --> 00:44:33,920
reputation going all the way back to

1213
00:44:38,309 --> 00:44:36,319
you know the roswell debris supposedly

1214
00:44:41,670 --> 00:44:38,319
going there whatever it was and then

1215
00:44:43,109 --> 00:44:41,680
um then there's talk of um you know

1216
00:44:46,230 --> 00:44:43,119
someone seeing an

1217
00:44:47,670 --> 00:44:46,240
an alien on a table under a blanket um

1218
00:44:49,109 --> 00:44:47,680
and you mentioned something about a

1219
00:44:52,790 --> 00:44:49,119
surgeon

1220
00:44:54,950 --> 00:44:52,800
so uh do you think there is really

1221
00:44:57,910 --> 00:44:54,960
something going on that

1222
00:44:59,589 --> 00:44:57,920
right pat have the has there been i i

1223
00:45:00,230 --> 00:44:59,599
think it'd be a perfect place to put

1224
00:45:03,430 --> 00:45:00,240
stuff

1225
00:45:05,349 --> 00:45:03,440
for years because going back to the you

1226
00:45:08,630 --> 00:45:05,359
know like you say the 1940s

1227
00:45:10,790 --> 00:45:08,640
uh they've collected a lot of stuff from

1228
00:45:12,710 --> 00:45:10,800
all over the country of croatia's

1229
00:45:14,230 --> 00:45:12,720
and it's not necessarily ufo related it

1230
00:45:18,790 --> 00:45:14,240
could be related to

1231
00:45:21,270 --> 00:45:18,800
you know potentially foreign aircraft uh

1232
00:45:24,950 --> 00:45:21,280
satellites etc because you've got a

1233
00:45:27,190 --> 00:45:24,960
great place to analyze stuff over there

1234
00:45:28,470 --> 00:45:27,200
and i remember the first time i've ever

1235
00:45:31,510 --> 00:45:28,480
heard the stories

1236
00:45:34,390 --> 00:45:31,520
about this stuff wasn't anything it was

1237
00:45:36,790 --> 00:45:34,400
before i think i knew about roswell uh

1238
00:45:39,270 --> 00:45:36,800
one of my buddies back in the 1960s his

1239
00:45:42,230 --> 00:45:39,280
brother was stationed down there

1240
00:45:44,390 --> 00:45:42,240
and he said his brother was military

1241
00:45:46,069 --> 00:45:44,400
security air force security

1242
00:45:47,349 --> 00:45:46,079
and he's claimed that there was a hangar

1243
00:45:48,950 --> 00:45:47,359
down there we just happened to be

1244
00:45:51,349 --> 00:45:48,960
talking about

1245
00:45:53,270 --> 00:45:51,359
um aliens one time because you know my

1246
00:45:55,510 --> 00:45:53,280
brother's stationed down at right pat he

1247
00:45:57,750 --> 00:45:55,520
goes there's a hangar down there

1248
00:46:00,710 --> 00:45:57,760
that he was told to kill anybody if they

1249
00:46:03,190 --> 00:46:00,720
ever got into it i said what he goes

1250
00:46:05,190 --> 00:46:03,200
yeah one of the hangers are regarding

1251
00:46:06,870 --> 00:46:05,200
that anybody who got in well that

1252
00:46:08,790 --> 00:46:06,880
creates you know number one the mystique

1253
00:46:11,589 --> 00:46:08,800
of something like that

1254
00:46:13,109 --> 00:46:11,599
that kind of attributes to that and he

1255
00:46:14,069 --> 00:46:13,119
implied basically that there that's

1256
00:46:17,349 --> 00:46:14,079
where the alien was

1257
00:46:18,870 --> 00:46:17,359
at well

1258
00:46:22,069 --> 00:46:18,880
bright pat's where the foreign

1259
00:46:23,750 --> 00:46:22,079
technology area has been for years

1260
00:46:25,270 --> 00:46:23,760
they employ a tremendous amount of

1261
00:46:26,950 --> 00:46:25,280
people down there

1262
00:46:28,390 --> 00:46:26,960
and a lot of stuff i think you're seeing

1263
00:46:30,309 --> 00:46:28,400
is actually maybe

1264
00:46:31,430 --> 00:46:30,319
maybe not be seeing is below ground down

1265
00:46:34,550 --> 00:46:31,440
there martin

1266
00:46:36,950 --> 00:46:34,560
a lot of stuff going on below ground

1267
00:46:38,470 --> 00:46:36,960
i think it'd be a perfect place to put

1268
00:46:39,430 --> 00:46:38,480
something on like that right in plain

1269
00:46:42,950 --> 00:46:39,440
sight

1270
00:46:46,710 --> 00:46:42,960
a lot of people maybe think of area 51

1271
00:46:47,349 --> 00:46:46,720
bases like that but do it in plain sight

1272
00:46:50,630 --> 00:46:47,359
and if they

1273
00:46:53,270 --> 00:46:50,640
obtained something back in the 1940s

1274
00:46:54,230 --> 00:46:53,280
they got something from roswell my

1275
00:46:57,109 --> 00:46:54,240
thought is

1276
00:46:58,630 --> 00:46:57,119
you basically bury it you put it below

1277
00:47:00,870 --> 00:46:58,640
ground

1278
00:47:02,550 --> 00:47:00,880
knowing first of all that to reverse

1279
00:47:05,589 --> 00:47:02,560
engineer an object if we recover

1280
00:47:05,990 --> 00:47:05,599
something is going to take not a couple

1281
00:47:11,750 --> 00:47:06,000
years

1282
00:47:12,630 --> 00:47:11,760
even begin to maybe reverse engineer

1283
00:47:15,589 --> 00:47:12,640
something

1284
00:47:18,150 --> 00:47:15,599
it to me it'd be like giving alan's

1285
00:47:20,710 --> 00:47:18,160
alexander graham bell a cell phone

1286
00:47:23,349 --> 00:47:20,720
and say build this thing could be done

1287
00:47:27,109 --> 00:47:23,359
because the technology

1288
00:47:28,870 --> 00:47:27,119
so you bury it below ground basically

1289
00:47:31,430 --> 00:47:28,880
to me that would be the perfect thing to

1290
00:47:33,430 --> 00:47:31,440
do then that gives you access to start

1291
00:47:36,390 --> 00:47:33,440
reverse engineering stuff

1292
00:47:36,790 --> 00:47:36,400
in the state of ohio one of the groups

1293
00:47:40,069 --> 00:47:36,800
that

1294
00:47:40,950 --> 00:47:40,079
um has been named of doing revision

1295
00:47:44,230 --> 00:47:40,960
engineering

1296
00:47:45,910 --> 00:47:44,240
was battelle industries but tell

1297
00:47:46,470 --> 00:47:45,920
industries we understand it originally

1298
00:47:48,549 --> 00:47:46,480
was

1299
00:47:50,630 --> 00:47:48,559
going back to metallurgy doing

1300
00:47:53,589 --> 00:47:50,640
metallurgical research

1301
00:47:55,510 --> 00:47:53,599
and then money was put in to fund the

1302
00:47:56,870 --> 00:47:55,520
institution down there

1303
00:47:58,710 --> 00:47:56,880
well think about this you've got an

1304
00:48:00,309 --> 00:47:58,720
organization which did metallurgical

1305
00:48:02,870 --> 00:48:00,319
research

1306
00:48:04,630 --> 00:48:02,880
going way back they would be a perfect

1307
00:48:05,109 --> 00:48:04,640
one to potentially bring in and start

1308
00:48:08,390 --> 00:48:05,119
doing

1309
00:48:10,230 --> 00:48:08,400
analysis of any metals down there

1310
00:48:11,430 --> 00:48:10,240
they were a big player back in that time

1311
00:48:14,230 --> 00:48:11,440
frame

1312
00:48:14,950 --> 00:48:14,240
so you've got a connection there we've

1313
00:48:17,589 --> 00:48:14,960
actually had

1314
00:48:19,109 --> 00:48:17,599
a number of individuals in mufon who

1315
00:48:21,510 --> 00:48:19,119
worked for battelle off and on but they

1316
00:48:23,829 --> 00:48:21,520
don't really say a whole lot

1317
00:48:25,510 --> 00:48:23,839
uh our former state director bill jones

1318
00:48:28,630 --> 00:48:25,520
worked for battelle industries

1319
00:48:30,950 --> 00:48:28,640
for years about that

1320
00:48:34,230 --> 00:48:30,960
wow but they don't you know they don't

1321
00:48:36,870 --> 00:48:34,240
know anything about those regions

1322
00:48:38,230 --> 00:48:36,880
you've also got in this case medical

1323
00:48:39,910 --> 00:48:38,240
facilities

1324
00:48:42,870 --> 00:48:39,920
like in this case going back to case

1325
00:48:47,349 --> 00:48:45,750
cleveland clinic if you want stuff

1326
00:48:50,630 --> 00:48:47,359
analyzed

1327
00:48:51,750 --> 00:48:50,640
the story that i stumbled across was

1328
00:48:53,990 --> 00:48:51,760
when i was a member of the cleveland

1329
00:48:55,670 --> 00:48:54,000
ufology project

1330
00:48:57,430 --> 00:48:55,680
they told me that one of the former

1331
00:49:00,710 --> 00:48:57,440
members

1332
00:49:01,270 --> 00:49:00,720
his name was stanley tycho he was a

1333
00:49:05,190 --> 00:49:01,280
doctor

1334
00:49:05,880 --> 00:49:05,200
at case western he was reportedly called

1335
00:49:07,030 --> 00:49:05,890
down to

1336
00:49:11,030 --> 00:49:07,040
[Music]

1337
00:49:15,589 --> 00:49:11,040
analyze a body at wright patterson

1338
00:49:19,109 --> 00:49:17,430
and human one thing he made he was

1339
00:49:20,870 --> 00:49:19,119
examining he said the heart was very

1340
00:49:22,790 --> 00:49:20,880
very unusual he said it wasn't just him

1341
00:49:24,630 --> 00:49:22,800
analyzing it it appeared that they

1342
00:49:25,109 --> 00:49:24,640
brought specialists in from all over the

1343
00:49:28,150 --> 00:49:25,119
country

1344
00:49:29,990 --> 00:49:28,160
in certain fields now can we can we just

1345
00:49:33,829 --> 00:49:30,000
pause here one sec

1346
00:49:34,710 --> 00:49:33,839
um how was he so freely talking about

1347
00:49:37,109 --> 00:49:34,720
this

1348
00:49:38,870 --> 00:49:37,119
if that was the case he didn't talk

1349
00:49:40,230 --> 00:49:38,880
about it freely to group only a couple

1350
00:49:41,510 --> 00:49:40,240
individuals in the group that were kind

1351
00:49:45,030 --> 00:49:41,520
of like

1352
00:49:46,710 --> 00:49:45,040
this the long-term members that also had

1353
00:49:49,750 --> 00:49:46,720
been involved in defense department

1354
00:49:54,230 --> 00:49:51,190
it seems like this would be highly

1355
00:49:57,670 --> 00:49:54,240
classified and he would not be able to

1356
00:49:59,670 --> 00:49:57,680
ever talk about it publicly or

1357
00:50:00,870 --> 00:49:59,680
reportedly what he did is he turned a

1358
00:50:02,790 --> 00:50:00,880
report in

1359
00:50:04,950 --> 00:50:02,800
he had like one day to do his analysis

1360
00:50:09,270 --> 00:50:04,960
turn the report in and that was it

1361
00:50:11,109 --> 00:50:09,280
walk away he didn't talk about it openly

1362
00:50:13,750 --> 00:50:11,119
matter of fact the members of the group

1363
00:50:15,270 --> 00:50:13,760
he played a very located he was even a

1364
00:50:17,030 --> 00:50:15,280
doctor

1365
00:50:18,549 --> 00:50:17,040
they said he came in dressed like

1366
00:50:20,549 --> 00:50:18,559
anybody else in the meeting

1367
00:50:22,309 --> 00:50:20,559
didn't you know kind of flaunt the fact

1368
00:50:24,069 --> 00:50:22,319
he was a doctor

1369
00:50:25,589 --> 00:50:24,079
but a couple of members in the group

1370
00:50:26,870 --> 00:50:25,599
were the only ones he told about and

1371
00:50:27,510 --> 00:50:26,880
that's because they had been involved

1372
00:50:30,870 --> 00:50:27,520
with

1373
00:50:32,069 --> 00:50:30,880
at one time

1374
00:50:33,829 --> 00:50:32,079
so you're kind of hearing this like

1375
00:50:35,589 --> 00:50:33,839
second or third hand yeah secondhand

1376
00:50:37,750 --> 00:50:35,599
information on here and the the thing is

1377
00:50:41,109 --> 00:50:37,760
the photographs they supposedly

1378
00:50:44,069 --> 00:50:41,119
attain you attained a photograph

1379
00:50:45,750 --> 00:50:44,079
uh we could never recover but what was

1380
00:50:47,270 --> 00:50:45,760
kind of interesting is you always kind

1381
00:50:49,030 --> 00:50:47,280
of have doubts sometimes when you hear

1382
00:50:53,349 --> 00:50:49,040
these secondhand stories

1383
00:51:00,069 --> 00:50:53,359
yeah i was doing um a project with

1384
00:51:06,950 --> 00:51:03,510
in the meeting where there's ten of us

1385
00:51:11,270 --> 00:51:06,960
his name came up out of nowhere

1386
00:51:13,270 --> 00:51:11,280
involved with um an autopsy

1387
00:51:14,630 --> 00:51:13,280
and the person was out in denver was

1388
00:51:17,030 --> 00:51:14,640
talking about this i'm like where did

1389
00:51:18,870 --> 00:51:17,040
you get his name from

1390
00:51:22,069 --> 00:51:18,880
and it caught me completely off guard

1391
00:51:24,230 --> 00:51:22,079
but somehow that had gotten out

1392
00:51:25,589 --> 00:51:24,240
can you describe everything you know

1393
00:51:26,950 --> 00:51:25,599
about this and we have

1394
00:51:28,230 --> 00:51:26,960
we have four minutes we're going to be

1395
00:51:29,670 --> 00:51:28,240
going into the break and then we'll talk

1396
00:51:30,309 --> 00:51:29,680
about your case after the break that

1397
00:51:33,109 --> 00:51:30,319
we're

1398
00:51:33,829 --> 00:51:33,119
okay is linked to the video on our show

1399
00:51:37,030 --> 00:51:33,839
well this one

1400
00:51:39,270 --> 00:51:37,040
uh taika was very well respected down at

1401
00:51:41,190 --> 00:51:39,280
the clinic in his field

1402
00:51:42,630 --> 00:51:41,200
they brought him in and i understand it

1403
00:51:45,349 --> 00:51:42,640
they told me

1404
00:51:46,870 --> 00:51:45,359
especially was pathology but i'm just

1405
00:51:48,950 --> 00:51:46,880
wondering if it was more into chemistry

1406
00:51:50,790 --> 00:51:48,960
from what i can find out about him

1407
00:51:53,190 --> 00:51:50,800
uh you can't find a tremendous amount

1408
00:51:55,430 --> 00:51:53,200
about autumn on the internet

1409
00:51:57,270 --> 00:51:55,440
but he was brought in as a pathologist

1410
00:51:58,950 --> 00:51:57,280
and in the united states cleveland

1411
00:52:01,510 --> 00:51:58,960
clinic is well respected and has been

1412
00:52:03,750 --> 00:52:01,520
for years on pathology

1413
00:52:05,109 --> 00:52:03,760
he was brought in to do part of an

1414
00:52:07,990 --> 00:52:05,119
autopsy

1415
00:52:09,109 --> 00:52:08,000
other members were all brought in as a

1416
00:52:11,270 --> 00:52:09,119
team

1417
00:52:12,710 --> 00:52:11,280
to go through and do individual portions

1418
00:52:15,910 --> 00:52:12,720
of an autopsy

1419
00:52:17,510 --> 00:52:15,920
and turn the report like you say he was

1420
00:52:20,470 --> 00:52:17,520
basically told to kind of like

1421
00:52:21,430 --> 00:52:20,480
forget about this walk away from any

1422
00:52:24,630 --> 00:52:21,440
attorney report

1423
00:52:28,069 --> 00:52:24,640
in and and kind of forget about it

1424
00:52:31,109 --> 00:52:28,079
but a couple the longer term members

1425
00:52:33,430 --> 00:52:31,119
of the group he

1426
00:52:35,750 --> 00:52:33,440
confided into him that he'd gone down to

1427
00:52:38,630 --> 00:52:35,760
do an autopsy

1428
00:52:39,510 --> 00:52:38,640
and it also came out from the family

1429
00:52:42,549 --> 00:52:39,520
that they didn't say

1430
00:52:44,829 --> 00:52:42,559
autopsy but they said he went to dayton

1431
00:52:48,230 --> 00:52:44,839
he went to wright patterson was flown

1432
00:52:52,790 --> 00:52:48,240
down and he had no connection

1433
00:52:54,390 --> 00:52:52,800
uh with wright-patterson air force base

1434
00:52:56,069 --> 00:52:54,400
so he brought him down basically out of

1435
00:52:57,589 --> 00:52:56,079
nowhere for that like that one day and

1436
00:52:59,829 --> 00:52:57,599
then brought him back

1437
00:53:00,790 --> 00:52:59,839
can you speak on anything anatomically

1438
00:53:03,910 --> 00:53:00,800
about

1439
00:53:05,990 --> 00:53:03,920
what he described well the thing that

1440
00:53:07,750 --> 00:53:06,000
popped up the one again this the

1441
00:53:08,950 --> 00:53:07,760
information came back to me second hand

1442
00:53:12,549 --> 00:53:08,960
is

1443
00:53:15,109 --> 00:53:12,559
the heart he said was unusual in the

1444
00:53:18,710 --> 00:53:15,119
fact of the number of chambers it had

1445
00:53:21,510 --> 00:53:18,720
it wasn't like a human heart

1446
00:53:23,750 --> 00:53:21,520
it had a different number of chambers

1447
00:53:25,910 --> 00:53:23,760
did you talk about the the way the thing

1448
00:53:28,870 --> 00:53:25,920
looked though you know

1449
00:53:31,109 --> 00:53:28,880
describe the features it go went back to

1450
00:53:34,870 --> 00:53:31,119
the basically the typical gray type

1451
00:53:36,790 --> 00:53:34,880
alien it's what was being described

1452
00:53:39,190 --> 00:53:36,800
the thing that he because he had a

1453
00:53:40,390 --> 00:53:39,200
picture that uh he was showing people of

1454
00:53:43,990 --> 00:53:40,400
a gray

1455
00:53:46,150 --> 00:53:44,000
and said this is basically what he saw

1456
00:53:47,910 --> 00:53:46,160
he supposedly had a photograph he locked

1457
00:53:49,589 --> 00:53:47,920
up in a safety deposit box that we

1458
00:53:51,510 --> 00:53:49,599
couldn't find

1459
00:53:53,109 --> 00:53:51,520
that who knows what happened to the

1460
00:53:54,069 --> 00:53:53,119
safety deposit box family may have

1461
00:53:56,710 --> 00:53:54,079
cleaned stuff out

1462
00:53:57,990 --> 00:53:56,720
and who knows what but why let me just

1463
00:54:00,470 --> 00:53:58,000
ask you so why would they

1464
00:54:02,069 --> 00:54:00,480
allow him to take a photograph i don't

1465
00:54:03,910 --> 00:54:02,079
know if they knew he took a photograph

1466
00:54:06,150 --> 00:54:03,920
or he just obtained the photograph that

1467
00:54:09,670 --> 00:54:06,160
was as close as he could get

1468
00:54:13,030 --> 00:54:11,750
but he he was struck by the fact of the

1469
00:54:15,109 --> 00:54:13,040
heart having

1470
00:54:17,750 --> 00:54:15,119
an unusual number of chambers for

1471
00:54:19,910 --> 00:54:17,760
something it was humanoid

1472
00:54:22,150 --> 00:54:19,920
then the one person i kept i heard from

1473
00:54:23,030 --> 00:54:22,160
is he couldn't get over that fact about

1474
00:54:26,150 --> 00:54:23,040
the heart

1475
00:54:27,670 --> 00:54:26,160
having unusual number of chambers and

1476
00:54:29,190 --> 00:54:27,680
that fascinating more than anything

1477
00:54:33,190 --> 00:54:29,200
about

1478
00:54:35,270 --> 00:54:33,200
the being itself yeah is that one fact

1479
00:54:36,309 --> 00:54:35,280
i mean i would think every part of

1480
00:54:38,390 --> 00:54:36,319
something

1481
00:54:39,670 --> 00:54:38,400
would be fascinating like the brain and

1482
00:54:43,109 --> 00:54:39,680
you know whatever

1483
00:54:44,630 --> 00:54:43,119
uh how how it breathes what i could find

1484
00:54:46,309 --> 00:54:44,640
out the heart chamber

1485
00:54:47,829 --> 00:54:46,319
the number of chambers was more similar

1486
00:54:51,270 --> 00:54:47,839
to something like a fish

1487
00:54:55,030 --> 00:54:51,280
than a humanoid hmm

1488
00:54:56,549 --> 00:54:55,040
wow fascinating stuff whether you know

1489
00:54:58,230 --> 00:54:56,559
we'll never know if it was true or not

1490
00:55:00,549 --> 00:54:58,240
but it's it's still

1491
00:55:01,750 --> 00:55:00,559
it's really something to contemplate and

1492
00:55:03,430 --> 00:55:01,760
a possibility

1493
00:55:05,430 --> 00:55:03,440
but we're right at the break now so

1494
00:55:06,390 --> 00:55:05,440
we're going to go into it so hang in

1495
00:55:08,549 --> 00:55:06,400
everyone uh

1496
00:55:09,510 --> 00:55:08,559
we'll be right back right after these

1497
00:55:11,990 --> 00:55:09,520
messages

1498
00:55:13,430 --> 00:55:12,000
and uh for those of you in youtube uh

1499
00:55:15,190 --> 00:55:13,440
we're gonna be watching a

1500
00:55:17,360 --> 00:55:15,200
clip and we're gonna be talking about it

1501
00:55:19,190 --> 00:55:17,370
we'll be right back

1502
00:55:21,470 --> 00:55:19,200
[Music]

1503
00:55:23,430 --> 00:55:21,480
the case was reported on august 30th

1504
00:55:25,829 --> 00:55:23,440
2014

1505
00:55:28,870 --> 00:55:25,839
and was classified really as missing

1506
00:55:36,789 --> 00:55:32,630
in the paranormal world there are many

1507
00:55:38,870 --> 00:55:36,799
documented missing time cases

1508
00:55:40,309 --> 00:55:38,880
a couple of fishermen were out in this

1509
00:55:42,309 --> 00:55:40,319
area

1510
00:55:46,390 --> 00:55:42,319
and earlier in the evening reported

1511
00:55:51,109 --> 00:55:49,430
two fishermen at salt fork state park in

1512
00:55:54,230 --> 00:55:51,119
lower city ohio

1513
00:55:55,190 --> 00:55:54,240
say they experienced this phenomenon in

1514
00:55:58,710 --> 00:55:55,200
an area they had

1515
00:56:00,470 --> 00:55:58,720
fished many times before but about 1

1516
00:56:02,230 --> 00:56:00,480
30 that's when they remembered the last

1517
00:56:04,230 --> 00:56:02,240
time of getting ready to put the logs in

1518
00:56:06,630 --> 00:56:04,240
the fire

1519
00:56:07,589 --> 00:56:06,640
the next thing you remembered it was 5

1520
00:56:09,990 --> 00:56:07,599
19 in the morning

1521
00:56:12,549 --> 00:56:10,000
they lost roughly about 3 hours and 45

1522
00:56:15,190 --> 00:56:12,559
minutes of time

1523
00:56:16,549 --> 00:56:15,200
thomas wertman is a special investigator

1524
00:56:19,190 --> 00:56:16,559
ufo reports

1525
00:56:19,750 --> 00:56:19,200
around the cleveland area and state

1526
00:56:22,870 --> 00:56:19,760
director

1527
00:56:25,910 --> 00:56:22,880
for mufon also known as the mutual

1528
00:56:27,270 --> 00:56:25,920
ufo network ohio we're an international

1529
00:56:29,589 --> 00:56:27,280
organization

1530
00:56:31,349 --> 00:56:29,599
and our whole goal is scientific

1531
00:56:33,109 --> 00:56:31,359
research of ufos

1532
00:56:34,950 --> 00:56:33,119
we did have some sightings a number of

1533
00:56:37,510 --> 00:56:34,960
years ago down by the terminal tower

1534
00:56:37,990 --> 00:56:37,520
wertman says northeast ohio ranks number

1535
00:56:41,510 --> 00:56:38,000
eight

1536
00:56:43,109 --> 00:56:41,520
in the nation for ufo sightings document

1537
00:56:46,390 --> 00:56:43,119
those historical cases

1538
00:56:47,349 --> 00:56:46,400
in fact he has almost a dozen open cases

1539
00:56:49,910 --> 00:56:47,359
locally

1540
00:56:51,510 --> 00:56:49,920
right now you see green spots up here

1541
00:56:52,470 --> 00:56:51,520
they have numbers telling us like in

1542
00:56:54,789 --> 00:56:52,480
this case

1543
00:56:56,950 --> 00:56:54,799
in ohio we've got five roughly the

1544
00:57:00,789 --> 00:56:56,960
northeast ohio

1545
00:57:02,069 --> 00:57:00,799
here's the blue book files his research

1546
00:57:05,270 --> 00:57:02,079
only heightened

1547
00:57:08,309 --> 00:57:05,280
now that project blue book a secret u.s

1548
00:57:11,910 --> 00:57:08,319
air force investigation into reported

1549
00:57:12,870 --> 00:57:11,920
ufo sightings became available online

1550
00:57:16,390 --> 00:57:12,880
for free

1551
00:57:17,990 --> 00:57:16,400
130 000 documents online for somebody to

1552
00:57:20,710 --> 00:57:18,000
look at

1553
00:57:23,430 --> 00:57:20,720
it's called the black vault and it puts

1554
00:57:24,230 --> 00:57:23,440
project blue books declassified ufo

1555
00:57:26,950 --> 00:57:24,240
files

1556
00:57:29,030 --> 00:57:26,960
in one searchable database the origins

1557
00:57:30,390 --> 00:57:29,040
of project blue book all go back to ohio

1558
00:57:31,670 --> 00:57:30,400
that's where all the programs are pretty

1559
00:57:33,349 --> 00:57:31,680
much based from

1560
00:57:35,589 --> 00:57:33,359
right out of wright-patterson air force

1561
00:57:38,309 --> 00:57:35,599
base

1562
00:57:40,150 --> 00:57:38,319
and up until now the files could only be

1563
00:57:41,030 --> 00:57:40,160
accessed by visiting the national

1564
00:57:44,549 --> 00:57:41,040
archives

1565
00:57:46,390 --> 00:57:44,559
in washington d.c these documents happen

1566
00:57:49,829 --> 00:57:46,400
to be found in a garage

1567
00:57:51,589 --> 00:57:49,839
in dayton and 36 years later a man by

1568
00:57:54,950 --> 00:57:51,599
the name of john greenwald

1569
00:57:56,870 --> 00:57:54,960
put project blue book online well what

1570
00:57:58,789 --> 00:57:56,880
john did is he got the idea of taking

1571
00:58:01,430 --> 00:57:58,799
all these blue book files

1572
00:58:04,630 --> 00:58:01,440
putting them online in pdf format so

1573
00:58:08,230 --> 00:58:07,030
which could provide some clues into

1574
00:58:12,069 --> 00:58:08,240
workman's most

1575
00:58:13,829 --> 00:58:12,079
recent investigation what happened

1576
00:58:15,349 --> 00:58:13,839
to the two fishermen during their

1577
00:58:18,789 --> 00:58:15,359
strange case

1578
00:58:19,990 --> 00:58:18,799
of missing time a lot of people when

1579
00:58:22,950 --> 00:58:20,000
they hear the term

1580
00:58:25,829 --> 00:58:22,960
missing time is potential abduction

1581
00:58:31,030 --> 00:58:25,839
being abducted by ufo

1582
00:58:37,430 --> 00:58:34,150
in cleveland melissa reid fox 8 news

1583
00:58:37,990 --> 00:58:37,440
all right welcome back um this is martin

1584
00:58:40,950 --> 00:58:38,000
willis

1585
00:58:41,750 --> 00:58:40,960
and my guest tonight is uh thomas

1586
00:58:45,190 --> 00:58:41,760
wortman

1587
00:58:48,870 --> 00:58:45,200
um thomas i i i want to

1588
00:58:50,309 --> 00:58:48,880
um where did i put you hang on just a

1589
00:58:52,069 --> 00:58:50,319
second all right

1590
00:58:53,910 --> 00:58:52,079
uh we got swapped around here is what's

1591
00:58:55,270 --> 00:58:53,920
going on um

1592
00:58:57,190 --> 00:58:55,280
i want to address something because i

1593
00:58:58,309 --> 00:58:57,200
saw you know in the in the chat room and

1594
00:59:03,670 --> 00:58:58,319
i understand

1595
00:59:05,910 --> 00:59:03,680
talking about something so

1596
00:59:07,190 --> 00:59:05,920
well i want to say way out there as

1597
00:59:10,470 --> 00:59:07,200
someone you know

1598
00:59:14,950 --> 00:59:10,480
uh giving an autopsy to an alien

1599
00:59:17,990 --> 00:59:14,960
how whacked out that sounds and uh

1600
00:59:18,470 --> 00:59:18,000
i'll just say this i don't know if

1601
00:59:23,109 --> 00:59:18,480
that's

1602
00:59:24,710 --> 00:59:23,119
like this actually happened

1603
00:59:26,870 --> 00:59:24,720
i don't believe that you think it

1604
00:59:28,710 --> 00:59:26,880
actually 100 percent

1605
00:59:30,950 --> 00:59:28,720
you're certain that it happened it's

1606
00:59:31,670 --> 00:59:30,960
it's it's it's something it's second

1607
00:59:33,589 --> 00:59:31,680
hand

1608
00:59:35,990 --> 00:59:33,599
it's something someone said and it it's

1609
00:59:38,630 --> 00:59:36,000
fascinating if it's true

1610
00:59:40,309 --> 00:59:38,640
you're right i i don't take it for for

1611
00:59:42,150 --> 00:59:40,319
granted it happened

1612
00:59:44,470 --> 00:59:42,160
because i look at the same holes you're

1613
00:59:46,150 --> 00:59:44,480
probably looking at the stories on there

1614
00:59:50,150 --> 00:59:46,160
why don't we have more information here

1615
00:59:51,589 --> 00:59:50,160
and there there's been an uh another

1616
00:59:54,150 --> 00:59:51,599
situation where

1617
00:59:56,950 --> 00:59:54,160
um i had an individual who claimed to

1618
00:59:58,549 --> 00:59:56,960
have walked in on an autopsy down there

1619
01:00:02,630 --> 00:59:58,559
who is involved with the medical

1620
01:00:09,510 --> 01:00:06,309
we received a call at mufon

1621
01:00:10,789 --> 01:00:09,520
that i was asked specifically to go out

1622
01:00:14,870 --> 01:00:10,799
and interview the witness

1623
01:00:17,910 --> 01:00:14,880
one-on-one because it was kind of

1624
01:00:20,950 --> 01:00:17,920
misinterpreted to begin with that the

1625
01:00:23,109 --> 01:00:20,960
in the the alien was actually alive that

1626
01:00:25,270 --> 01:00:23,119
the individual saw

1627
01:00:26,870 --> 01:00:25,280
well i was able to contact the witness

1628
01:00:28,549 --> 01:00:26,880
we met at a restaurant because he didn't

1629
01:00:30,150 --> 01:00:28,559
want to meet

1630
01:00:32,789 --> 01:00:30,160
privately he wanted to be in a public

1631
01:00:36,950 --> 01:00:32,799
place he was afraid

1632
01:00:39,349 --> 01:00:36,960
this happened back in the 1980s

1633
01:00:41,030 --> 01:00:39,359
he showed me information where he was in

1634
01:00:42,309 --> 01:00:41,040
the military he was stationed at right

1635
01:00:44,150 --> 01:00:42,319
pat at that time

1636
01:00:46,630 --> 01:00:44,160
he showed me where information where he

1637
01:00:48,470 --> 01:00:46,640
was in that position he claimed to be in

1638
01:00:50,710 --> 01:00:48,480
and he went on to describe where he'd

1639
01:00:54,150 --> 01:00:50,720
walked in on an autopsy completely by

1640
01:00:55,030 --> 01:00:54,160
accident again this is a situation where

1641
01:00:57,349 --> 01:00:55,040
he described

1642
01:00:58,309 --> 01:00:57,359
a gray type being laying on an autopsy

1643
01:01:00,069 --> 01:00:58,319
table

1644
01:01:03,030 --> 01:01:00,079
supposedly military personnel and

1645
01:01:06,309 --> 01:01:03,040
individuals were in suits all around him

1646
01:01:09,430 --> 01:01:06,319
and the reportedly he thought that the

1647
01:01:11,829 --> 01:01:09,440
body that he saw them examining

1648
01:01:13,430 --> 01:01:11,839
was stored in one of the vaults at the

1649
01:01:18,630 --> 01:01:13,440
morgue

1650
01:01:20,069 --> 01:01:18,640
in the some place in the facility

1651
01:01:22,390 --> 01:01:20,079
this is one of the stories when i heard

1652
01:01:24,789 --> 01:01:22,400
it you know in one hand it sounds okay

1653
01:01:25,510 --> 01:01:24,799
plausible but there's holes in those

1654
01:01:28,069 --> 01:01:25,520
stories

1655
01:01:28,630 --> 01:01:28,079
when you go back and say okay i said

1656
01:01:31,990 --> 01:01:28,640
tell me

1657
01:01:34,150 --> 01:01:32,000
you know here's a map of the facility

1658
01:01:35,670 --> 01:01:34,160
show me where the morgue was at and he

1659
01:01:38,069 --> 01:01:35,680
couldn't put his finger on where the

1660
01:01:41,589 --> 01:01:38,079
morgue was located on the map of

1661
01:01:43,270 --> 01:01:41,599
the base so you start seeing you know

1662
01:01:44,950 --> 01:01:43,280
holes in it so what you have at the end

1663
01:01:49,109 --> 01:01:44,960
of the day is interesting stories

1664
01:01:50,549 --> 01:01:49,119
that could have happened possibly

1665
01:01:52,230 --> 01:01:50,559
and i said why do you want to talk about

1666
01:01:55,510 --> 01:01:52,240
it and was the typical

1667
01:01:57,190 --> 01:01:55,520
well i'm old i'm not afraid anymore and

1668
01:01:58,309 --> 01:01:57,200
i want to get my story out before i pass

1669
01:02:01,589 --> 01:01:58,319
away

1670
01:02:04,630 --> 01:02:01,599
that type of a deal on there yeah and

1671
01:02:07,190 --> 01:02:04,640
and we have heard that uh many times

1672
01:02:08,710 --> 01:02:07,200
you know and and some of it could be

1673
01:02:12,549 --> 01:02:08,720
real and some of it

1674
01:02:15,270 --> 01:02:12,559
has definitely been shown to be false

1675
01:02:17,430 --> 01:02:15,280
right and a few people that have uh even

1676
01:02:19,270 --> 01:02:17,440
i think maybe five years ago

1677
01:02:21,510 --> 01:02:19,280
um there was what was called the

1678
01:02:24,630 --> 01:02:21,520
deathbed confession and ended up

1679
01:02:26,390 --> 01:02:24,640
unfortunately not not being right there

1680
01:02:28,789 --> 01:02:26,400
there was one of what anonymous i think

1681
01:02:31,109 --> 01:02:28,799
was called

1682
01:02:32,069 --> 01:02:31,119
yeah that right that might be it yeah

1683
01:02:35,510 --> 01:02:32,079
yeah

1684
01:02:38,470 --> 01:02:35,520
um so we uh during the break we played

1685
01:02:39,990 --> 01:02:38,480
the clip um for those of uh you over at

1686
01:02:42,549 --> 01:02:40,000
kgra radio

1687
01:02:43,510 --> 01:02:42,559
um i would like for you if you would go

1688
01:02:45,589 --> 01:02:43,520
into a little bit of

1689
01:02:47,190 --> 01:02:45,599
what we just watched and let's let's

1690
01:02:49,270 --> 01:02:47,200
talk and the in-depth

1691
01:02:50,950 --> 01:02:49,280
work you did on that particular case but

1692
01:02:53,910 --> 01:02:50,960
at first a nutshell of it

1693
01:02:55,829 --> 01:02:53,920
well that was a case where craig lane at

1694
01:02:58,069 --> 01:02:55,839
that time was in charge of stuff coming

1695
01:03:00,390 --> 01:02:58,079
in for the star team

1696
01:03:01,829 --> 01:03:00,400
he received the phone call at mufon it

1697
01:03:05,589 --> 01:03:01,839
says hey

1698
01:03:08,630 --> 01:03:05,599
the individual said i was out fishing

1699
01:03:10,630 --> 01:03:08,640
uh me and another friend we're out

1700
01:03:11,190 --> 01:03:10,640
fishing we go to same fishing hole every

1701
01:03:14,390 --> 01:03:11,200
weekend

1702
01:03:18,150 --> 01:03:14,400
we've done it for several years we're

1703
01:03:22,950 --> 01:03:19,430
we don't know what happened during the

1704
01:03:26,069 --> 01:03:22,960
night somehow we lost time

1705
01:03:27,750 --> 01:03:26,079
and he was freaking out he says we lost

1706
01:03:29,829 --> 01:03:27,760
over three hours of time from what we

1707
01:03:32,150 --> 01:03:29,839
can tell

1708
01:03:32,870 --> 01:03:32,160
didn't claim like seeing ufo at that

1709
01:03:34,870 --> 01:03:32,880
point

1710
01:03:37,270 --> 01:03:34,880
but he says i don't know who to turn to

1711
01:03:38,950 --> 01:03:37,280
to you know

1712
01:03:40,789 --> 01:03:38,960
try to research this try to find out

1713
01:03:42,549 --> 01:03:40,799
what happened

1714
01:03:45,750 --> 01:03:42,559
so craig contacted me and asked me if

1715
01:03:48,309 --> 01:03:45,760
i'd go down and investigate this

1716
01:03:49,990 --> 01:03:48,319
he was talking to the witness he was

1717
01:03:53,270 --> 01:03:50,000
preparing reports

1718
01:03:54,710 --> 01:03:53,280
and he says i'll have a report filed and

1719
01:03:57,670 --> 01:03:54,720
he says i'll have to report to

1720
01:03:59,349 --> 01:03:57,680
you in about an hour and a half maybe

1721
01:04:01,029 --> 01:03:59,359
well what i did is he gave me the

1722
01:04:02,549 --> 01:04:01,039
witness's name

1723
01:04:04,470 --> 01:04:02,559
he gave me the approximate location

1724
01:04:06,950 --> 01:04:04,480
where it happened at so i started going

1725
01:04:09,750 --> 01:04:06,960
back and doing research before

1726
01:04:11,190 --> 01:04:09,760
anything went any farther i pulled

1727
01:04:13,750 --> 01:04:11,200
flight plans

1728
01:04:14,789 --> 01:04:13,760
for the region because he said what

1729
01:04:18,150 --> 01:04:14,799
happened is on

1730
01:04:20,470 --> 01:04:18,160
like august uh 30th actually august 29th

1731
01:04:22,549 --> 01:04:20,480
is what had happened these two guys were

1732
01:04:24,950 --> 01:04:22,559
fishing at salt fork state park which is

1733
01:04:27,270 --> 01:04:24,960
in southern ohio

1734
01:04:29,510 --> 01:04:27,280
as a side note there's reportedly a lot

1735
01:04:30,069 --> 01:04:29,520
of paranormal activity down in the same

1736
01:04:33,750 --> 01:04:30,079
region

1737
01:04:35,510 --> 01:04:33,760
including bigfoot and so forth on there

1738
01:04:37,029 --> 01:04:35,520
so he said it happened at the state park

1739
01:04:39,510 --> 01:04:37,039
he gave me a rough area of the state

1740
01:04:44,069 --> 01:04:41,349
so i started pulling flight plans to

1741
01:04:46,230 --> 01:04:44,079
look for potential knowns

1742
01:04:48,390 --> 01:04:46,240
i can go back two years pulling flight

1743
01:04:51,990 --> 01:04:48,400
plans on stuff

1744
01:04:52,470 --> 01:04:52,000
well he said that basically to begin

1745
01:04:54,549 --> 01:04:52,480
with at

1746
01:04:56,470 --> 01:04:54,559
roughly about 10 o'clock they saw a set

1747
01:04:57,510 --> 01:04:56,480
of lights 10 30 saw said light so i

1748
01:04:59,510 --> 01:04:57,520
started pulling

1749
01:05:01,109 --> 01:04:59,520
things from there on out so i pulled

1750
01:05:04,069 --> 01:05:01,119
flight plans

1751
01:05:04,549 --> 01:05:04,079
and i said okay i identified anything

1752
01:05:07,109 --> 01:05:04,559
within

1753
01:05:09,190 --> 01:05:07,119
a visible range of where they were at i

1754
01:05:11,589 --> 01:05:09,200
made a note of all that stuff

1755
01:05:13,270 --> 01:05:11,599
i also did some other things he told me

1756
01:05:16,069 --> 01:05:13,280
to witness his

1757
01:05:18,150 --> 01:05:16,079
names and i went back and actually went

1758
01:05:20,950 --> 01:05:18,160
on facebook and places like that to see

1759
01:05:21,990 --> 01:05:20,960
what activities are involved with i want

1760
01:05:24,789 --> 01:05:22,000
to see if these people

1761
01:05:26,710 --> 01:05:24,799
are you know reporting tons of stuff i

1762
01:05:29,109 --> 01:05:26,720
saw nothing where they posted related

1763
01:05:30,470 --> 01:05:29,119
anything related to ufos

1764
01:05:32,470 --> 01:05:30,480
so it's not like they're going to

1765
01:05:33,270 --> 01:05:32,480
paranormal websites posting stuff all

1766
01:05:35,670 --> 01:05:33,280
the time

1767
01:05:36,710 --> 01:05:35,680
there was nothing like that there i also

1768
01:05:38,950 --> 01:05:36,720
found out i went

1769
01:05:40,390 --> 01:05:38,960
uh i pulled linkedin and found out what

1770
01:05:41,990 --> 01:05:40,400
they did for a living

1771
01:05:43,589 --> 01:05:42,000
because they also had linkedin on their

1772
01:05:46,870 --> 01:05:43,599
websites

1773
01:05:47,589 --> 01:05:46,880
so i did all of that so i pulled up as

1774
01:05:50,710 --> 01:05:47,599
much

1775
01:05:52,230 --> 01:05:50,720
information about them i contacted the

1776
01:05:55,190 --> 01:05:52,240
witness

1777
01:05:56,069 --> 01:05:55,200
we talked over the whole events he said

1778
01:05:59,750 --> 01:05:56,079
that what happened

1779
01:06:02,710 --> 01:05:59,760
was they used that same fishing hole

1780
01:06:03,270 --> 01:06:02,720
every weekend that he was roughly in his

1781
01:06:06,309 --> 01:06:03,280
40s

1782
01:06:08,309 --> 01:06:06,319
owned the business

1783
01:06:09,910 --> 01:06:08,319
the individual was with him was a 19

1784
01:06:13,270 --> 01:06:09,920
year old that was his

1785
01:06:15,349 --> 01:06:13,280
daughter's boyfriend he said we're very

1786
01:06:17,109 --> 01:06:15,359
very good friends

1787
01:06:18,470 --> 01:06:17,119
basically what happens is one can start

1788
01:06:20,549 --> 01:06:18,480
a sentence the other can finish it they

1789
01:06:22,150 --> 01:06:20,559
know each other that well

1790
01:06:25,109 --> 01:06:22,160
they've got an excellent relationship he

1791
01:06:26,870 --> 01:06:25,119
says we go down fishing every weekend

1792
01:06:29,430 --> 01:06:26,880
he says nothing has happened for the

1793
01:06:32,710 --> 01:06:29,440
last couple years

1794
01:06:35,750 --> 01:06:32,720
so he says we're down here on the 29th

1795
01:06:38,069 --> 01:06:35,760
he says we went down we set up a canopy

1796
01:06:39,910 --> 01:06:38,079
we put our coolers out we put chairs up

1797
01:06:41,829 --> 01:06:39,920
right on the edge of the water

1798
01:06:44,870 --> 01:06:41,839
he says we had our fishing poles propped

1799
01:06:48,710 --> 01:06:44,880
up over the water's edge

1800
01:06:51,510 --> 01:06:48,720
we had a bonfire lit he says what we do

1801
01:06:53,510 --> 01:06:51,520
is we've got a routine that we do we

1802
01:06:55,990 --> 01:06:53,520
start our fire

1803
01:06:56,789 --> 01:06:56,000
we start fishing he says we actually

1804
01:06:59,510 --> 01:06:56,799
play a game

1805
01:06:59,990 --> 01:06:59,520
while we're fishing he says the game is

1806
01:07:02,630 --> 01:07:00,000
we guess

1807
01:07:05,270 --> 01:07:02,640
how close it is to a certain time frame

1808
01:07:07,510 --> 01:07:05,280
to putting wood on the fire

1809
01:07:09,510 --> 01:07:07,520
he says we use a type of oak he said

1810
01:07:11,349 --> 01:07:09,520
roughly every half hour

1811
01:07:13,990 --> 01:07:11,359
we have to put wood on the fire to keep

1812
01:07:16,390 --> 01:07:14,000
it going the way we want it

1813
01:07:17,750 --> 01:07:16,400
so he says we guess exactly how close we

1814
01:07:20,309 --> 01:07:17,760
can come to 30 minute

1815
01:07:22,230 --> 01:07:20,319
time frames all night long it's just a

1816
01:07:24,549 --> 01:07:22,240
game

1817
01:07:25,349 --> 01:07:24,559
i s one of my thoughts in the background

1818
01:07:27,990 --> 01:07:25,359
was okay

1819
01:07:29,510 --> 01:07:28,000
you had coolers out okay i wonder what

1820
01:07:31,109 --> 01:07:29,520
they may have had in the coolers

1821
01:07:32,549 --> 01:07:31,119
yeah you have to go there you know yeah

1822
01:07:34,069 --> 01:07:32,559
sure yeah

1823
01:07:36,150 --> 01:07:34,079
so they said you know everything is

1824
01:07:39,750 --> 01:07:36,160
completely normal he says

1825
01:07:41,430 --> 01:07:39,760
where we're at uh is a site where you

1826
01:07:41,829 --> 01:07:41,440
can look out over the lake he says on

1827
01:07:42,950 --> 01:07:41,839
the far

1828
01:07:45,190 --> 01:07:42,960
side of the lake there's a couple

1829
01:07:46,789 --> 01:07:45,200
fishermen over there he says those guys

1830
01:07:47,829 --> 01:07:46,799
are drunk almost every weekend because

1831
01:07:50,630 --> 01:07:47,839
you can hear them kind of partying

1832
01:07:53,829 --> 01:07:50,640
making a noise and yucking it up

1833
01:07:55,510 --> 01:07:53,839
he says that night they weren't there he

1834
01:07:55,990 --> 01:07:55,520
says so we're going along and all of a

1835
01:07:59,430 --> 01:07:56,000
sudden

1836
01:08:02,309 --> 01:07:59,440
about 10 30 we see this light

1837
01:08:03,270 --> 01:08:02,319
he says it's slightly smaller than the

1838
01:08:05,270 --> 01:08:03,280
moon

1839
01:08:07,190 --> 01:08:05,280
this light is to the north and it's

1840
01:08:10,309 --> 01:08:07,200
traveling

1841
01:08:12,150 --> 01:08:10,319
just above the horizon of the trees

1842
01:08:13,750 --> 01:08:12,160
he says so i'm here you know right along

1843
01:08:15,510 --> 01:08:13,760
the edge of the water

1844
01:08:17,590 --> 01:08:15,520
so i start walking down the edge of the

1845
01:08:19,269 --> 01:08:17,600
lake a little bit to get a better view

1846
01:08:22,309 --> 01:08:19,279
and i'm just watching this thing going

1847
01:08:24,309 --> 01:08:22,319
slowly or down the horizon

1848
01:08:26,550 --> 01:08:24,319
the 19 year old who's with him is doing

1849
01:08:28,149 --> 01:08:26,560
the same thing

1850
01:08:29,510 --> 01:08:28,159
and he says you know we watch it for a

1851
01:08:30,870 --> 01:08:29,520
little while watch it for a little while

1852
01:08:32,070 --> 01:08:30,880
all of a sudden i just went back to

1853
01:08:35,349 --> 01:08:32,080
fishing

1854
01:08:38,229 --> 01:08:35,359
so i said so you see this bright light

1855
01:08:40,070 --> 01:08:38,239
a little bit smaller than the moon you

1856
01:08:42,470 --> 01:08:40,080
watch for a bit and you got bored of

1857
01:08:43,829 --> 01:08:42,480
watching it you go back to fishing

1858
01:08:47,990 --> 01:08:43,839
because yeah that's that's kind of what

1859
01:08:51,749 --> 01:08:48,000
i did you know so he goes back fishing

1860
01:08:53,749 --> 01:08:51,759
at an hour later

1861
01:08:56,229 --> 01:08:53,759
they see another set of lights going

1862
01:08:57,910 --> 01:08:56,239
more vertically over them

1863
01:09:00,149 --> 01:08:57,920
they start watching those lights as

1864
01:09:01,910 --> 01:09:00,159
they're going across

1865
01:09:03,590 --> 01:09:01,920
they're not as big as the moon they're

1866
01:09:05,669 --> 01:09:03,600
smaller

1867
01:09:07,990 --> 01:09:05,679
they watch them go across the sky and

1868
01:09:09,910 --> 01:09:08,000
disappear

1869
01:09:11,110 --> 01:09:09,920
so everything was defined they didn't

1870
01:09:12,709 --> 01:09:11,120
think anything was unusual and all

1871
01:09:14,229 --> 01:09:12,719
sudden they started getting more nervous

1872
01:09:16,070 --> 01:09:14,239
they don't know why but started feeling

1873
01:09:18,309 --> 01:09:16,080
more nervous

1874
01:09:20,149 --> 01:09:18,319
about 1 30 they heard a voice that

1875
01:09:24,070 --> 01:09:20,159
sounded like a shrill woman cr

1876
01:09:27,510 --> 01:09:24,080
screaming out in the night now

1877
01:09:29,349 --> 01:09:27,520
that state park is is kind of i mean

1878
01:09:31,110 --> 01:09:29,359
there's nothing much out there there may

1879
01:09:32,950 --> 01:09:31,120
be a few houses reaching but not a whole

1880
01:09:35,030 --> 01:09:32,960
lot going on

1881
01:09:36,870 --> 01:09:35,040
that voice freaked them out so bad

1882
01:09:39,189 --> 01:09:36,880
martin

1883
01:09:40,550 --> 01:09:39,199
that the 40 year old said hey i nearly

1884
01:09:41,829 --> 01:09:40,560
threw everything back in the truck and

1885
01:09:45,829 --> 01:09:41,839
said i'm out of here

1886
01:09:48,229 --> 01:09:45,839
i'm gone but he decided to stay

1887
01:09:49,829 --> 01:09:48,239
and he says that was the last thing he

1888
01:09:51,510 --> 01:09:49,839
remembered

1889
01:09:53,430 --> 01:09:51,520
he says he's sitting in his chair he

1890
01:09:55,270 --> 01:09:53,440
goes back sits in his chair

1891
01:09:58,070 --> 01:09:55,280
the 19 year old is standing along the

1892
01:09:59,430 --> 01:09:58,080
edge of the lake he's baiting his hook

1893
01:10:01,350 --> 01:09:59,440
he said that's another thing we did is

1894
01:10:03,590 --> 01:10:01,360
we baited our hooks every so many

1895
01:10:05,990 --> 01:10:03,600
minutes to keep fresh bait under all

1896
01:10:07,590 --> 01:10:06,000
night long

1897
01:10:09,110 --> 01:10:07,600
they're standing these the one is

1898
01:10:10,149 --> 01:10:09,120
standing the other one's setting he says

1899
01:10:11,270 --> 01:10:10,159
the next thing you know he's looking

1900
01:10:14,229 --> 01:10:11,280
around he says

1901
01:10:15,669 --> 01:10:14,239
something didn't seem right so he picks

1902
01:10:17,669 --> 01:10:15,679
his cell phone up

1903
01:10:19,750 --> 01:10:17,679
and it's 5 19 in the morning so he

1904
01:10:23,910 --> 01:10:19,760
doesn't remember anything from roughly 1

1905
01:10:27,110 --> 01:10:23,920
30 to 5 19 in the morning

1906
01:10:30,149 --> 01:10:27,120
he says i

1907
01:10:32,149 --> 01:10:30,159
goes

1908
01:10:33,590 --> 01:10:32,159
hey you know what i'm saying guess what

1909
01:10:38,470 --> 01:10:33,600
he says it's 5 19

1910
01:10:42,070 --> 01:10:38,480
dude that's when they really freaked out

1911
01:10:43,510 --> 01:10:42,080
he says because the 19 year old is still

1912
01:10:45,750 --> 01:10:43,520
standing there baiting his hook like he

1913
01:10:47,350 --> 01:10:45,760
was doing at 1 30.

1914
01:10:50,149 --> 01:10:47,360
and they don't know anything to happen

1915
01:10:52,950 --> 01:10:50,159
in between that time frame

1916
01:10:54,229 --> 01:10:52,960
so they freaked out they changed clothes

1917
01:10:55,669 --> 01:10:54,239
they had a change of clothes that they

1918
01:10:56,870 --> 01:10:55,679
always took with them to get other

1919
01:10:59,110 --> 01:10:56,880
fishing clothes

1920
01:11:00,390 --> 01:10:59,120
they threw the clothes in the truck they

1921
01:11:02,390 --> 01:11:00,400
took everything back down

1922
01:11:05,990 --> 01:11:02,400
threw it in their truck and and drove

1923
01:11:09,030 --> 01:11:06,000
roughly about 120 miles back home

1924
01:11:10,709 --> 01:11:09,040
that's when they called mufon up

1925
01:11:13,110 --> 01:11:10,719
so i got their story from them over the

1926
01:11:14,950 --> 01:11:13,120
phone made all my notes

1927
01:11:17,270 --> 01:11:14,960
and i said you know i'd really like to

1928
01:11:20,149 --> 01:11:17,280
see this area where you're at

1929
01:11:21,590 --> 01:11:20,159
i said would you go back down right now

1930
01:11:25,830 --> 01:11:21,600
he's like what

1931
01:11:29,189 --> 01:11:25,840
i said would you drive back down again

1932
01:11:30,790 --> 01:11:29,199
he says you know okay but when i drive i

1933
01:11:34,070 --> 01:11:30,800
just want to let you know he says i go

1934
01:11:36,229 --> 01:11:34,080
80 miles an hour everywhere

1935
01:11:38,070 --> 01:11:36,239
i said 80. i said first of all mufon

1936
01:11:41,110 --> 01:11:38,080
does not pay my speeding tickets

1937
01:11:42,950 --> 01:11:41,120
yeah i'm on my own so you know

1938
01:11:44,709 --> 01:11:42,960
can you hold it down he goes no this is

1939
01:11:48,149 --> 01:11:44,719
the way i drive

1940
01:11:50,630 --> 01:11:48,159
so i met him uh close to his house which

1941
01:11:54,790 --> 01:11:50,640
is over in the akron area

1942
01:11:56,149 --> 01:11:54,800
we drove down an interstate 80 miles an

1943
01:11:59,350 --> 01:11:56,159
hour the whole way

1944
01:12:01,669 --> 01:11:59,360
he was dead serious we get down there

1945
01:12:04,149 --> 01:12:01,679
and we did a complete reenactment

1946
01:12:05,669 --> 01:12:04,159
i said okay take me through your whole

1947
01:12:07,189 --> 01:12:05,679
routine for tonight

1948
01:12:09,110 --> 01:12:07,199
so he took me through the routine where

1949
01:12:11,030 --> 01:12:09,120
his canopy was where the canopy went

1950
01:12:14,630 --> 01:12:11,040
where the fire went

1951
01:12:16,550 --> 01:12:14,640
and so forth and he goes by the way he

1952
01:12:18,709 --> 01:12:16,560
says the fire was completely burned out

1953
01:12:21,750 --> 01:12:18,719
at 5 19.

1954
01:12:23,669 --> 01:12:21,760
he says no wood was put back on the fire

1955
01:12:26,950 --> 01:12:23,679
it completely burned out like we hadn't

1956
01:12:30,229 --> 01:12:26,960
put anything on there since 1 30.

1957
01:12:31,910 --> 01:12:30,239
so we reenacted it he had his coolers in

1958
01:12:33,189 --> 01:12:31,920
the back i grabbed the coolers and i

1959
01:12:34,830 --> 01:12:33,199
flipped them open to look to see what

1960
01:12:36,550 --> 01:12:34,840
was inside and all they had was bottled

1961
01:12:38,709 --> 01:12:36,560
water

1962
01:12:40,390 --> 01:12:38,719
but i look at little details too under

1963
01:12:43,030 --> 01:12:40,400
martin one thing i noticed on his hand

1964
01:12:46,310 --> 01:12:43,040
was an unusual tattoo

1965
01:12:49,510 --> 01:12:46,320
and i said what does this mean

1966
01:12:51,830 --> 01:12:49,520
he goes well i had basically a major

1967
01:12:54,709 --> 01:12:51,840
change in my life

1968
01:12:56,390 --> 01:12:54,719
he implied that basically he he was

1969
01:12:57,669 --> 01:12:56,400
doing things he wasn't happy with in the

1970
01:12:59,990 --> 01:12:57,679
past he had to change him he had to

1971
01:13:01,910 --> 01:13:00,000
correct something in his life

1972
01:13:04,709 --> 01:13:01,920
well one of the things that i kind of

1973
01:13:07,110 --> 01:13:04,719
caught a hint of is maybe had some

1974
01:13:08,950 --> 01:13:07,120
issues in the past

1975
01:13:11,189 --> 01:13:08,960
not criminal issues maybe issues

1976
01:13:12,470 --> 01:13:11,199
something along the lines of drinking

1977
01:13:15,270 --> 01:13:12,480
that he was correcting that he was

1978
01:13:17,189 --> 01:13:15,280
getting away from that stuff

1979
01:13:18,709 --> 01:13:17,199
hence the bottled water was all i found

1980
01:13:19,510 --> 01:13:18,719
in his cooler that's all they were

1981
01:13:21,590 --> 01:13:19,520
drinking

1982
01:13:23,910 --> 01:13:21,600
i found no evidence of drugs anything

1983
01:13:27,830 --> 01:13:23,920
like that around

1984
01:13:32,790 --> 01:13:31,110
and as we're talking

1985
01:13:33,910 --> 01:13:32,800
i'm walking around the state park a

1986
01:13:35,910 --> 01:13:33,920
little bit around that region they're

1987
01:13:38,310 --> 01:13:35,920
showing me where they were camped at

1988
01:13:40,070 --> 01:13:38,320
they're describing the whole thing and

1989
01:13:41,430 --> 01:13:40,080
it's you've got a picture up there

1990
01:13:43,430 --> 01:13:41,440
now where it's kind of like the state

1991
01:13:45,350 --> 01:13:43,440
park at the one major place this is a

1992
01:13:47,910 --> 01:13:45,360
little bit more remote place

1993
01:13:48,709 --> 01:13:47,920
you won't see anything around other than

1994
01:13:49,990 --> 01:13:48,719
like a beach

1995
01:13:53,350 --> 01:13:50,000
small beach here and i think i sent you

1996
01:13:56,630 --> 01:13:53,360
a photograph of that in your email

1997
01:13:59,350 --> 01:13:56,640
so we're out there and there

1998
01:14:01,030 --> 01:13:59,360
it's here it's getting dark eventually

1999
01:14:03,830 --> 01:14:01,040
it gets the point where about 11 o'clock

2000
01:14:06,630 --> 01:14:03,840
at night we're still in the state park

2001
01:14:08,470 --> 01:14:06,640
the 19 year old is getting more nervous

2002
01:14:10,870 --> 01:14:08,480
as we go

2003
01:14:12,630 --> 01:14:10,880
any little crack any little twig that he

2004
01:14:14,790 --> 01:14:12,640
heard that night

2005
01:14:15,669 --> 01:14:14,800
he was just about to jump out of his

2006
01:14:19,270 --> 01:14:15,679
pants

2007
01:14:23,990 --> 01:14:19,280
he was so scared he was so much on edge

2008
01:14:26,070 --> 01:14:24,000
the 40 year old was not as high strung

2009
01:14:27,750 --> 01:14:26,080
but he was getting there and by the way

2010
01:14:29,990 --> 01:14:27,760
to 19 year old the best way to describe

2011
01:14:33,750 --> 01:14:30,000
him he's kind of like barney fife

2012
01:14:35,350 --> 01:14:33,760
he was that nervous on there well at one

2013
01:14:37,830 --> 01:14:35,360
point

2014
01:14:38,870 --> 01:14:37,840
uh i sensed something and i've had

2015
01:14:41,189 --> 01:14:38,880
experiences it

2016
01:14:42,630 --> 01:14:41,199
would be for a whole another like in a

2017
01:14:45,750 --> 01:14:42,640
whole nother episode or something like

2018
01:14:47,669 --> 01:14:45,760
that where i've had an encounter myself

2019
01:14:49,110 --> 01:14:47,679
and i felt something in that region and

2020
01:14:50,790 --> 01:14:49,120
i don't say i'm psychic

2021
01:14:52,390 --> 01:14:50,800
but for some reason i had an unusual

2022
01:14:56,630 --> 01:14:52,400
feeling that something was happening

2023
01:15:00,630 --> 01:14:56,640
over in a certain region out of view

2024
01:15:02,310 --> 01:15:00,640
so i just kind of played it cool

2025
01:15:04,550 --> 01:15:02,320
we went through we finished up like

2026
01:15:06,470 --> 01:15:04,560
after 11 30.

2027
01:15:08,149 --> 01:15:06,480
we started driving back home and we're

2028
01:15:09,350 --> 01:15:08,159
going back the same interstate we went

2029
01:15:11,830 --> 01:15:09,360
down

2030
01:15:13,669 --> 01:15:11,840
and something that i noticed was we're

2031
01:15:14,070 --> 01:15:13,679
driving back going 80 miles an hour

2032
01:15:16,950 --> 01:15:14,080
again

2033
01:15:18,709 --> 01:15:16,960
here we are going 80. we come around a

2034
01:15:21,750 --> 01:15:18,719
turn and here's a really bright cell

2035
01:15:23,189 --> 01:15:21,760
phone tower right in front of us

2036
01:15:25,350 --> 01:15:23,199
the minute the light comes in view he

2037
01:15:27,510 --> 01:15:25,360
slows down to 50 or slower on the

2038
01:15:29,590 --> 01:15:27,520
interstate

2039
01:15:31,430 --> 01:15:29,600
i'm like that's unusual he slowed down

2040
01:15:33,910 --> 01:15:31,440
why'd he slow down and i looked i saw

2041
01:15:35,590 --> 01:15:33,920
this big bright light ahead of us

2042
01:15:38,470 --> 01:15:35,600
we get around the bend away from the

2043
01:15:41,510 --> 01:15:38,480
light and also he speeds back up to 80.

2044
01:15:42,390 --> 01:15:41,520
he had no clue that light caused a

2045
01:15:46,070 --> 01:15:42,400
reaction

2046
01:15:47,830 --> 01:15:46,080
in him to slow down

2047
01:15:49,350 --> 01:15:47,840
so i'm thinking is there a relationship

2048
01:15:51,189 --> 01:15:49,360
to that light and something that may

2049
01:15:52,950 --> 01:15:51,199
have happened that night

2050
01:15:54,310 --> 01:15:52,960
well he talked about that light that he

2051
01:15:57,430 --> 01:15:54,320
saw at 10 30

2052
01:16:00,630 --> 01:15:57,440
bright light low over the water

2053
01:16:02,149 --> 01:16:00,640
in my research i found out there was

2054
01:16:03,990 --> 01:16:02,159
nothing in that area

2055
01:16:07,750 --> 01:16:04,000
any aircraft close that area i could

2056
01:16:11,110 --> 01:16:07,760
find in that time frame

2057
01:16:12,790 --> 01:16:11,120
the one at 11 30 an hour later there is

2058
01:16:14,630 --> 01:16:12,800
actually a plane operated by quest

2059
01:16:16,709 --> 01:16:14,640
medical technologies transporting

2060
01:16:17,430 --> 01:16:16,719
medical supplies that went directly over

2061
01:16:19,990 --> 01:16:17,440
at that time

2062
01:16:21,270 --> 01:16:20,000
frame the second light i think is

2063
01:16:23,430 --> 01:16:21,280
explainable

2064
01:16:24,870 --> 01:16:23,440
the first one at least from what i had

2065
01:16:27,350 --> 01:16:24,880
access to i couldn't find any

2066
01:16:29,669 --> 01:16:27,360
explanation

2067
01:16:31,270 --> 01:16:29,679
but i'm thinking maybe something that

2068
01:16:33,669 --> 01:16:31,280
happened after that first light

2069
01:16:35,669 --> 01:16:33,679
something connected to it caused a cause

2070
01:16:39,830 --> 01:16:35,679
and effect

2071
01:16:44,709 --> 01:16:42,229
so i went back did more research matter

2072
01:16:46,310 --> 01:16:44,719
of fact i got their clothes

2073
01:16:47,990 --> 01:16:46,320
uh i said can i have your clothes that

2074
01:16:49,110 --> 01:16:48,000
you did to change yeah we'll get them to

2075
01:16:51,590 --> 01:16:49,120
you

2076
01:16:52,470 --> 01:16:51,600
well i did something that mufon will

2077
01:16:56,470 --> 01:16:52,480
know about now

2078
01:16:59,030 --> 01:16:56,480
if they don't already mufon said you

2079
01:17:00,070 --> 01:16:59,040
submit clothing and articles in right

2080
01:17:03,430 --> 01:17:00,080
away

2081
01:17:06,790 --> 01:17:03,440
i didn't uh i put them in a box

2082
01:17:08,390 --> 01:17:06,800
in my office well i put in my box my

2083
01:17:11,270 --> 01:17:08,400
office for a reason

2084
01:17:14,070 --> 01:17:11,280
when i submit them to mufon uh i would

2085
01:17:15,590 --> 01:17:14,080
have to send them out to california

2086
01:17:18,390 --> 01:17:15,600
they would look at them they'd have to

2087
01:17:21,430 --> 01:17:18,400
go through potential you know contact

2088
01:17:23,270 --> 01:17:21,440
maybe contamination and they'd be sent

2089
01:17:24,950 --> 01:17:23,280
to a friend of mine who lives only about

2090
01:17:27,910 --> 01:17:24,960
30 miles from me

2091
01:17:31,510 --> 01:17:27,920
she's the one who'd do the analysis so i

2092
01:17:33,990 --> 01:17:31,520
cut out the middleman

2093
01:17:35,430 --> 01:17:34,000
i called her up she's a very good friend

2094
01:17:37,189 --> 01:17:35,440
of mine i said

2095
01:17:38,630 --> 01:17:37,199
can you do some analysis for me on some

2096
01:17:40,709 --> 01:17:38,640
clothing

2097
01:17:42,950 --> 01:17:40,719
because she's got instruments to do

2098
01:17:45,189 --> 01:17:42,960
extremely detailed on the spectroscopic

2099
01:17:47,350 --> 01:17:45,199
analysis

2100
01:17:49,350 --> 01:17:47,360
i said can you look these clothes over

2101
01:17:53,510 --> 01:17:49,360
for me

2102
01:17:56,229 --> 01:17:53,520
i also i took those out to her

2103
01:17:57,669 --> 01:17:56,239
and i just gave her a little information

2104
01:17:59,590 --> 01:17:57,679
not a whole lot

2105
01:18:01,510 --> 01:17:59,600
and i said i found out there in

2106
01:18:03,270 --> 01:18:01,520
construction so potentially some of the

2107
01:18:05,030 --> 01:18:03,280
stuff that you find on there may be

2108
01:18:06,790 --> 01:18:05,040
contamination from paint

2109
01:18:08,229 --> 01:18:06,800
i don't know but it's something if you

2110
01:18:10,149 --> 01:18:08,239
come across something

2111
01:18:11,430 --> 01:18:10,159
but we saw spots and some other things

2112
01:18:15,030 --> 01:18:11,440
on the clothing

2113
01:18:16,709 --> 01:18:15,040
so i gave her those i also had contact

2114
01:18:17,750 --> 01:18:16,719
with the witnesses after that case

2115
01:18:19,430 --> 01:18:17,760
because i'm like

2116
01:18:21,270 --> 01:18:19,440
man are they trying to just copycat

2117
01:18:22,950 --> 01:18:21,280
something like another ufo case out

2118
01:18:25,110 --> 01:18:22,960
there with fishermen and a boat and

2119
01:18:26,390 --> 01:18:25,120
stuff like that

2120
01:18:28,470 --> 01:18:26,400
so they said they go down to this

2121
01:18:30,470 --> 01:18:28,480
fishing hole every weekend

2122
01:18:32,070 --> 01:18:30,480
the following weekend i drove down at

2123
01:18:34,630 --> 01:18:32,080
four and actually about

2124
01:18:36,310 --> 01:18:34,640
two in the morning got down to about

2125
01:18:38,149 --> 01:18:36,320
three in the morning

2126
01:18:40,310 --> 01:18:38,159
and i'm walking the state park in the

2127
01:18:42,310 --> 01:18:40,320
dark by myself

2128
01:18:43,750 --> 01:18:42,320
i'm like i'm going to call their bluff

2129
01:18:46,550 --> 01:18:43,760
and see if they're here

2130
01:18:48,470 --> 01:18:46,560
well they weren't there wow the

2131
01:18:50,070 --> 01:18:48,480
fishermen across the lake who were drunk

2132
01:18:51,430 --> 01:18:50,080
were on the other side just like they

2133
01:18:53,030 --> 01:18:51,440
said

2134
01:18:55,189 --> 01:18:53,040
but they weren't but they told me they'd

2135
01:18:56,390 --> 01:18:55,199
been too scared to even go out of the

2136
01:18:58,950 --> 01:18:56,400
house they'd

2137
01:19:00,470 --> 01:18:58,960
they hadn't worked the whole week they

2138
01:19:02,709 --> 01:19:00,480
hadn't gone out of the house

2139
01:19:03,910 --> 01:19:02,719
and the 19 year old stayed with the 40

2140
01:19:05,669 --> 01:19:03,920
year old their families

2141
01:19:07,590 --> 01:19:05,679
all in one room they all slept in the

2142
01:19:09,750 --> 01:19:07,600
living room they said

2143
01:19:11,110 --> 01:19:09,760
i went down and saw and the wife's and

2144
01:19:12,390 --> 01:19:11,120
the girlfriend confirmed that

2145
01:19:14,470 --> 01:19:12,400
they said yeah we all sleep in the

2146
01:19:15,669 --> 01:19:14,480
living room at night they're too scared

2147
01:19:18,709 --> 01:19:15,679
to do anything

2148
01:19:19,430 --> 01:19:18,719
but all they have correct me if i i miss

2149
01:19:22,870 --> 01:19:19,440
something

2150
01:19:25,990 --> 01:19:22,880
but at this point all they had was

2151
01:19:29,350 --> 01:19:26,000
the missing time that's right see light

2152
01:19:31,669 --> 01:19:29,360
something ahead did did you suggest

2153
01:19:33,189 --> 01:19:31,679
that they tried like hypnotherapy

2154
01:19:36,149 --> 01:19:33,199
regression or anything

2155
01:19:37,910 --> 01:19:36,159
no they actually they brought it up and

2156
01:19:39,590 --> 01:19:37,920
i said i'd rather see if things come out

2157
01:19:41,669 --> 01:19:39,600
on their own first

2158
01:19:43,189 --> 01:19:41,679
let's let's just play out let's don't go

2159
01:19:44,630 --> 01:19:43,199
that route of doing regression or

2160
01:19:47,270 --> 01:19:44,640
anything like that

2161
01:19:47,669 --> 01:19:47,280
let's see what we can turn up uh you

2162
01:19:50,310 --> 01:19:47,679
know

2163
01:19:52,550 --> 01:19:50,320
like turn up in my investigation or

2164
01:19:54,149 --> 01:19:52,560
maybe what memories you may have

2165
01:19:58,550 --> 01:19:54,159
after this and let's just play it out

2166
01:20:00,550 --> 01:19:58,560
that way i didn't suggest a ufo at all

2167
01:20:02,870 --> 01:20:00,560
i said let's just pursue this as more

2168
01:20:05,510 --> 01:20:02,880
like missing time

2169
01:20:06,149 --> 01:20:05,520
the 40 year old by the way was a time

2170
01:20:08,870 --> 01:20:06,159
control

2171
01:20:10,550 --> 01:20:08,880
freak his wife confirmed that with me

2172
01:20:11,750 --> 01:20:10,560
separately she goes he's a nut about

2173
01:20:13,510 --> 01:20:11,760
time

2174
01:20:15,110 --> 01:20:13,520
she goes if he says he's going to be

2175
01:20:17,590 --> 01:20:15,120
someplace at seven o'clock if he gets

2176
01:20:19,510 --> 01:20:17,600
here at 701 he is mad

2177
01:20:21,030 --> 01:20:19,520
because he has to be in control of time

2178
01:20:22,149 --> 01:20:21,040
that perfectly and she goes he's

2179
01:20:24,550 --> 01:20:22,159
completely

2180
01:20:28,470 --> 01:20:24,560
obsessed with this right now i kind of

2181
01:20:31,990 --> 01:20:29,910
i always like to be right on time when i

2182
01:20:35,430 --> 01:20:32,000
do appointments i like to do that

2183
01:20:38,149 --> 01:20:35,440
too if not a few minutes early yes well

2184
01:20:39,510 --> 01:20:38,159
they took them a few weeks by the way to

2185
01:20:41,830 --> 01:20:39,520
get back to the point they're actually

2186
01:20:43,430 --> 01:20:41,840
working again

2187
01:20:44,870 --> 01:20:43,440
and when i went down the following

2188
01:20:46,629 --> 01:20:44,880
weekend

2189
01:20:48,310 --> 01:20:46,639
i went back and i didn't have stuff with

2190
01:20:50,310 --> 01:20:48,320
me in the original time but i pulled

2191
01:20:52,310 --> 01:20:50,320
soil samples

2192
01:20:53,990 --> 01:20:52,320
started reviewing the whole area as much

2193
01:20:55,910 --> 01:20:54,000
as i could i had

2194
01:20:58,149 --> 01:20:55,920
meters i was looking for potential

2195
01:20:59,030 --> 01:20:58,159
magnetic anomalies magnetic fields down

2196
01:21:00,550 --> 01:20:59,040
there

2197
01:21:03,110 --> 01:21:00,560
that was something that uh it was

2198
01:21:06,390 --> 01:21:03,120
suggested to me to look for

2199
01:21:09,510 --> 01:21:06,400
i got the soil samples i pulled out

2200
01:21:12,790 --> 01:21:09,520
i took the soil samples by the way in

2201
01:21:15,510 --> 01:21:12,800
in an area in particular that

2202
01:21:16,950 --> 01:21:15,520
i'm walking around the park as i'm

2203
01:21:18,950 --> 01:21:16,960
walking around the park i mean here's

2204
01:21:20,790 --> 01:21:18,960
this huge park

2205
01:21:22,629 --> 01:21:20,800
late at night two three in the morning

2206
01:21:23,830 --> 01:21:22,639
completely pitch black out the only

2207
01:21:26,310 --> 01:21:23,840
thing i have is a tiny

2208
01:21:27,990 --> 01:21:26,320
flashlight with me as i'm walking around

2209
01:21:31,030 --> 01:21:28,000
and for some reason martin i i

2210
01:21:32,709 --> 01:21:31,040
want not where they were at but i

2211
01:21:33,350 --> 01:21:32,719
started going over in a totally separate

2212
01:21:35,270 --> 01:21:33,360
area that

2213
01:21:37,430 --> 01:21:35,280
was kind of like where i had the unusual

2214
01:21:39,830 --> 01:21:37,440
feeling the week before

2215
01:21:40,790 --> 01:21:39,840
i said i think something happened right

2216
01:21:42,629 --> 01:21:40,800
in here

2217
01:21:44,310 --> 01:21:42,639
and i won't use the words that i used at

2218
01:21:47,189 --> 01:21:44,320
night

2219
01:21:49,030 --> 01:21:47,199
but i had the feeling something happened

2220
01:21:49,990 --> 01:21:49,040
and there was a very large tree right

2221
01:21:52,310 --> 01:21:50,000
there that was like

2222
01:21:53,830 --> 01:21:52,320
the only tree around the region and i

2223
01:21:56,229 --> 01:21:53,840
said i got a feeling it happened right

2224
01:21:58,390 --> 01:21:56,239
in this area in front of this tree

2225
01:21:59,830 --> 01:21:58,400
so i started taking soil samples around

2226
01:22:02,070 --> 01:21:59,840
that region marking them out in

2227
01:22:03,990 --> 01:22:02,080
reference to the tree

2228
01:22:06,870 --> 01:22:04,000
and i called my friend up and said i

2229
01:22:08,470 --> 01:22:06,880
need you to do soil analysis too

2230
01:22:10,390 --> 01:22:08,480
and i just gave her the samples that

2231
01:22:12,070 --> 01:22:10,400
were only numbered with no reference of

2232
01:22:14,070 --> 01:22:12,080
anything about them

2233
01:22:16,310 --> 01:22:14,080
i said you just tell me what you find in

2234
01:22:18,790 --> 01:22:16,320
the soil samples

2235
01:22:20,790 --> 01:22:18,800
well it took her a while and she said

2236
01:22:24,390 --> 01:22:20,800
number one the clothing

2237
01:22:26,149 --> 01:22:24,400
on the clothing she found

2238
01:22:27,750 --> 01:22:26,159
some chemicals that weren't completely

2239
01:22:30,470 --> 01:22:27,760
unusual

2240
01:22:31,590 --> 01:22:30,480
but these chemicals were related to

2241
01:22:34,950 --> 01:22:31,600
something more like

2242
01:22:37,189 --> 01:22:34,960
um deodorants but she goes

2243
01:22:39,110 --> 01:22:37,199
it's not unusual in what the chemicals

2244
01:22:41,830 --> 01:22:39,120
are but it's unusual where i found

2245
01:22:42,229 --> 01:22:41,840
the materials at on the clothing which

2246
01:22:43,590 --> 01:22:42,239
was

2247
01:22:45,830 --> 01:22:43,600
totally where you wouldn't put

2248
01:22:48,550 --> 01:22:45,840
deodorants at

2249
01:22:50,790 --> 01:22:48,560
and she goes just as a side note on

2250
01:22:52,870 --> 01:22:50,800
betty hill's dress was a similar type of

2251
01:22:54,470 --> 01:22:52,880
an issue from the hills case back in the

2252
01:22:56,790 --> 01:22:54,480
60s

2253
01:22:59,189 --> 01:22:56,800
that they found similar chemicals in

2254
01:23:01,189 --> 01:22:59,199
usual places on her clothing

2255
01:23:03,830 --> 01:23:01,199
and by the way she had a sample of betty

2256
01:23:06,709 --> 01:23:03,840
hill's dress

2257
01:23:09,030 --> 01:23:06,719
she said there was also a case in canada

2258
01:23:12,149 --> 01:23:09,040
involving a potential abduction

2259
01:23:14,149 --> 01:23:12,159
that was similar and she did extremely

2260
01:23:15,030 --> 01:23:14,159
detailed analysis on these and she said

2261
01:23:17,510 --> 01:23:15,040
that

2262
01:23:19,510 --> 01:23:17,520
the clothing in canada also had the

2263
01:23:19,990 --> 01:23:19,520
similar type of a chemical in unusual

2264
01:23:23,430 --> 01:23:20,000
places

2265
01:23:24,629 --> 01:23:23,440
on the clothing so we're looking for

2266
01:23:28,229 --> 01:23:24,639
correlating things so we

2267
01:23:30,790 --> 01:23:28,239
you know we had that and then when she

2268
01:23:33,189 --> 01:23:30,800
did the soil sample she said

2269
01:23:35,990 --> 01:23:33,199
you know the soil samples some had very

2270
01:23:41,189 --> 01:23:36,000
high iron content

2271
01:23:44,550 --> 01:23:41,199
and other ones didn't i said really

2272
01:23:46,229 --> 01:23:44,560
she said yeah and i said well i've got a

2273
01:23:49,189 --> 01:23:46,239
map that has a reference to where i took

2274
01:23:52,310 --> 01:23:49,199
all the samples from

2275
01:23:56,550 --> 01:23:52,320
and we marked out the area

2276
01:24:00,310 --> 01:23:56,560
going from like low to high iron content

2277
01:24:02,470 --> 01:24:00,320
the area i sensed was very unusual

2278
01:24:03,910 --> 01:24:02,480
had extremely high iron content compared

2279
01:24:06,550 --> 01:24:03,920
to the other

2280
01:24:08,790 --> 01:24:06,560
as you got away from what area i was at

2281
01:24:12,709 --> 01:24:08,800
by that one big tree in particular

2282
01:24:14,950 --> 01:24:12,719
it got much less an iron content

2283
01:24:16,709 --> 01:24:14,960
so what caused a hundred percent i don't

2284
01:24:21,510 --> 01:24:16,719
know but

2285
01:24:25,430 --> 01:24:25,110
anomalous level well what they told me

2286
01:24:30,310 --> 01:24:25,440
is

2287
01:24:32,790 --> 01:24:30,320
but they said that

2288
01:24:34,310 --> 01:24:32,800
in cases where there's been a potential

2289
01:24:37,270 --> 01:24:34,320
landing

2290
01:24:41,669 --> 01:24:37,280
they've noted higher iron content in the

2291
01:24:46,070 --> 01:24:43,669
and that was what we found is something

2292
01:24:48,229 --> 01:24:46,080
that an area that i sensed you know may

2293
01:24:49,750 --> 01:24:48,239
have been a

2294
01:24:51,270 --> 01:24:49,760
there was an unusual area just put it

2295
01:24:53,189 --> 01:24:51,280
that way it had

2296
01:24:54,950 --> 01:24:53,199
much higher levels of iron content than

2297
01:24:58,709 --> 01:24:54,960
the surrounding regions

2298
01:25:00,390 --> 01:24:58,719
so historically this has been um

2299
01:25:03,189 --> 01:25:00,400
where people have seen things land

2300
01:25:04,709 --> 01:25:03,199
before no this is where i just had that

2301
01:25:08,390 --> 01:25:04,719
unusual feeling

2302
01:25:11,110 --> 01:25:08,400
no no yeah historically there's

2303
01:25:14,310 --> 01:25:11,120
been samples pulled from where things

2304
01:25:16,310 --> 01:25:14,320
supposedly landed and there's high iron

2305
01:25:17,750 --> 01:25:16,320
yeah that's what i was told that in

2306
01:25:19,270 --> 01:25:17,760
other cases where they've had

2307
01:25:22,550 --> 01:25:19,280
potential landing sites they use the

2308
01:25:29,750 --> 01:25:25,990
through mufon yeah so

2309
01:25:31,590 --> 01:25:29,760
the so we looked at that

2310
01:25:33,270 --> 01:25:31,600
and what was unusual is i called the

2311
01:25:35,830 --> 01:25:33,280
witness up because i talked to him

2312
01:25:37,270 --> 01:25:35,840
multiple times after the case

2313
01:25:38,390 --> 01:25:37,280
i said you know i went down to see if

2314
01:25:39,910 --> 01:25:38,400
you guys were there the following

2315
01:25:40,629 --> 01:25:39,920
weekend you guys weren't there he goes

2316
01:25:44,470 --> 01:25:40,639
nope

2317
01:25:45,750 --> 01:25:44,480
staying in-house not going nowhere

2318
01:25:47,590 --> 01:25:45,760
i guess you could use the word hunkered

2319
01:25:50,229 --> 01:25:47,600
down now but yeah we're we're

2320
01:25:51,669 --> 01:25:50,239
basically hunkered down and i said you

2321
01:25:53,669 --> 01:25:51,679
know i was walking around that park and

2322
01:25:53,990 --> 01:25:53,679
i said i had a really unusual feeling

2323
01:25:57,270 --> 01:25:54,000
that

2324
01:26:01,030 --> 01:25:57,280
you know something happened down here

2325
01:26:02,629 --> 01:26:01,040
and he goes was it um you know about 100

2326
01:26:05,430 --> 01:26:02,639
yards from where he was at by this big

2327
01:26:09,910 --> 01:26:08,310
and that was where i was at i'm like how

2328
01:26:11,830 --> 01:26:09,920
did this guy know where i had this

2329
01:26:13,430 --> 01:26:11,840
feeling at because i gave no indication

2330
01:26:16,390 --> 01:26:13,440
that this happened

2331
01:26:17,510 --> 01:26:16,400
where it was at he told me where it

2332
01:26:19,750 --> 01:26:17,520
happened at

2333
01:26:21,590 --> 01:26:19,760
not when you were with them when you

2334
01:26:24,149 --> 01:26:21,600
visited place you never talked about it

2335
01:26:25,910 --> 01:26:24,159
nope nothing at all like that there was

2336
01:26:26,229 --> 01:26:25,920
no indication at all when they're martin

2337
01:26:28,310 --> 01:26:26,239
that

2338
01:26:29,590 --> 01:26:28,320
i had any unusual sensations as we were

2339
01:26:31,830 --> 01:26:29,600
down there that night

2340
01:26:33,430 --> 01:26:31,840
or in any phone call i just brought up

2341
01:26:34,950 --> 01:26:33,440
that i had you know a weird feeling down

2342
01:26:36,229 --> 01:26:34,960
there as i was walking around and he

2343
01:26:39,990 --> 01:26:36,239
told me

2344
01:26:43,590 --> 01:26:40,000
where i was at when i was walking around

2345
01:26:46,070 --> 01:26:43,600
he pinpointed it wow and i'm like

2346
01:26:47,270 --> 01:26:46,080
that's weird yeah now what's happened

2347
01:26:50,629 --> 01:26:47,280
since

2348
01:26:51,990 --> 01:26:50,639
this time can you remind me of when this

2349
01:26:55,430 --> 01:26:52,000
happened exactly

2350
01:26:57,910 --> 01:26:55,440
this goes back to august 30th of 2014.

2351
01:26:59,189 --> 01:26:57,920
2014. i thought this was routine yeah so

2352
01:27:01,830 --> 01:26:59,199
has anything

2353
01:27:02,709 --> 01:27:01,840
have you heard from them along the way

2354
01:27:05,990 --> 01:27:02,719
he's

2355
01:27:08,070 --> 01:27:06,000
been kind of very laid back about it

2356
01:27:10,070 --> 01:27:08,080
in that uh the only thing i've heard

2357
01:27:11,669 --> 01:27:10,080
come up that he's mentioned about that

2358
01:27:14,070 --> 01:27:11,679
you know about bringing out was he

2359
01:27:15,510 --> 01:27:14,080
happened to go to a uh

2360
01:27:18,149 --> 01:27:15,520
in salt fork they actually have a

2361
01:27:21,990 --> 01:27:18,159
bigfoot convention once a year

2362
01:27:24,790 --> 01:27:22,000
yeah i saw that one sign that said

2363
01:27:25,669 --> 01:27:24,800
i'll pull it up now big foot ridge

2364
01:27:27,030 --> 01:27:25,679
that's it

2365
01:27:28,629 --> 01:27:27,040
and by the way i was kind of wondering i

2366
01:27:29,910 --> 01:27:28,639
said man if bigfoot's down here when i

2367
01:27:30,950 --> 01:27:29,920
was searching that park at two in the

2368
01:27:32,470 --> 01:27:30,960
morning

2369
01:27:36,149 --> 01:27:32,480
he's going to be slipping and sliding on

2370
01:27:40,550 --> 01:27:38,870
easy pray yeah i'll tell you and i

2371
01:27:42,790 --> 01:27:40,560
needed somebody else there with me so at

2372
01:27:45,350 --> 01:27:42,800
least i could outrun one person maybe

2373
01:27:46,390 --> 01:27:45,360
you know push them behind yeah that's

2374
01:27:48,310 --> 01:27:46,400
right

2375
01:27:49,830 --> 01:27:48,320
but he brought it up at a bigfoot

2376
01:27:51,590 --> 01:27:49,840
conference he happened to be at he went

2377
01:27:53,910 --> 01:27:51,600
to one of the bigfoot conferences

2378
01:27:55,830 --> 01:27:53,920
down here and he just mentioned he was

2379
01:27:56,229 --> 01:27:55,840
yeah i just had an unusual case where i

2380
01:27:59,590 --> 01:27:56,239
saw

2381
01:28:01,990 --> 01:27:59,600
you know i had missing time down here

2382
01:28:03,669 --> 01:28:02,000
and he's never brought up the fact of he

2383
01:28:05,669 --> 01:28:03,679
saw ufo

2384
01:28:07,750 --> 01:28:05,679
he's just obsessed that he lost over

2385
01:28:12,149 --> 01:28:07,760
three hours of time with no explanation

2386
01:28:14,709 --> 01:28:12,159
whatsoever yeah that must feel really

2387
01:28:15,270 --> 01:28:14,719
i mean talk about not having control of

2388
01:28:18,149 --> 01:28:15,280
time

2389
01:28:19,830 --> 01:28:18,159
that must feel really awful when you're

2390
01:28:22,149 --> 01:28:19,840
trying to figure something like that out

2391
01:28:24,950 --> 01:28:22,159
yeah and by talking to them i mean they

2392
01:28:26,950 --> 01:28:24,960
seemed extremely credible

2393
01:28:28,550 --> 01:28:26,960
their story stayed consistent the whole

2394
01:28:30,229 --> 01:28:28,560
time you didn't see changes you didn't

2395
01:28:33,990 --> 01:28:30,239
see things being added even things

2396
01:28:38,629 --> 01:28:36,950
i've never brought up the idea about uh

2397
01:28:41,189 --> 01:28:38,639
hypnosis

2398
01:28:42,709 --> 01:28:41,199
uh regression and so forth i wonder if

2399
01:28:43,350 --> 01:28:42,719
they could do that now if it would make

2400
01:28:46,629 --> 01:28:43,360
sense

2401
01:28:47,350 --> 01:28:46,639
it it may because i happen to be doing a

2402
01:28:50,470 --> 01:28:47,360
talk

2403
01:28:53,590 --> 01:28:50,480
in that region a few weeks after

2404
01:28:55,030 --> 01:28:53,600
um i met with them the one time

2405
01:28:58,070 --> 01:28:55,040
and they found out there was actually

2406
01:28:59,910 --> 01:28:58,080
doing a talk on abduction

2407
01:29:01,430 --> 01:28:59,920
and they said why didn't you invite us

2408
01:29:02,550 --> 01:29:01,440
to your talk

2409
01:29:05,110 --> 01:29:02,560
and i said because i didn't want

2410
01:29:08,310 --> 01:29:05,120
anything i said to cross-contaminate

2411
01:29:09,910 --> 01:29:08,320
your own experiences so i wanted

2412
01:29:11,510 --> 01:29:09,920
everything like that completely kept

2413
01:29:14,709 --> 01:29:11,520
separate

2414
01:29:17,110 --> 01:29:14,719
which they appreciated on there and i

2415
01:29:18,470 --> 01:29:17,120
i said by the way i said i i have been

2416
01:29:21,030 --> 01:29:18,480
through experiences in my

2417
01:29:22,950 --> 01:29:21,040
in my own past history going back to the

2418
01:29:25,110 --> 01:29:22,960
1960s

2419
01:29:26,950 --> 01:29:25,120
where i've had experiences of missing

2420
01:29:28,870 --> 01:29:26,960
time and other events

2421
01:29:30,310 --> 01:29:28,880
uh seeing an object by the way very

2422
01:29:33,510 --> 01:29:30,320
close up

2423
01:29:36,470 --> 01:29:33,520
at roughly about 60 feet away

2424
01:29:38,470 --> 01:29:36,480
hovering above me wow nice oh you want

2425
01:29:40,149 --> 01:29:38,480
to talk about that a little bit i have a

2426
01:29:41,830 --> 01:29:40,159
question someone has you know just to

2427
01:29:43,110 --> 01:29:41,840
let you know we're going to be taking

2428
01:29:45,590 --> 01:29:43,120
calls as well

2429
01:29:46,550 --> 01:29:45,600
sure we can take them any time you want

2430
01:29:49,110 --> 01:29:46,560
but yeah

2431
01:29:50,310 --> 01:29:49,120
why don't you um i'll just bring this up

2432
01:29:51,910 --> 01:29:50,320
pop this up real quick

2433
01:29:53,510 --> 01:29:51,920
we don't want to forget this question

2434
01:29:57,750 --> 01:29:53,520
here do you know about the

2435
01:30:04,229 --> 01:30:01,270
not in not without double checking

2436
01:30:05,350 --> 01:30:04,239
notes that solves that but you actually

2437
01:30:06,070 --> 01:30:05,360
mentioned the name of somebody i

2438
01:30:09,270 --> 01:30:06,080
graduated

2439
01:30:12,390 --> 01:30:09,280
with is that right all right

2440
01:30:14,390 --> 01:30:12,400
so um uh i would not would like to

2441
01:30:15,990 --> 01:30:14,400
for you to talk about your own

2442
01:30:18,149 --> 01:30:16,000
experiences if you would

2443
01:30:19,350 --> 01:30:18,159
and meanwhile if someone would like to

2444
01:30:21,030 --> 01:30:19,360
call in

2445
01:30:23,750 --> 01:30:21,040
that phone number is up on the screen

2446
01:30:33,590 --> 01:30:23,760
and if you're over at kgra radio

2447
01:30:38,550 --> 01:30:34,390
and 855-472-5483-855-472-5483 will be

2448
01:30:43,350 --> 01:30:41,750
well back in the 1960s uh

2449
01:30:46,629 --> 01:30:43,360
my family lived in ohio we moved to

2450
01:30:49,430 --> 01:30:46,639
south carolina for about five years

2451
01:30:49,990 --> 01:30:49,440
one of the locations we lived at down

2452
01:30:53,430 --> 01:30:50,000
here

2453
01:30:54,709 --> 01:30:53,440
uh was out in a rural area i bought a

2454
01:30:56,550 --> 01:30:54,719
telescope the time i mean a couple

2455
01:30:57,990 --> 01:30:56,560
buddies used to go out and

2456
01:31:00,229 --> 01:30:58,000
get our telescopes out and i think it's

2457
01:31:01,750 --> 01:31:00,239
only probably about 11 12 at the time

2458
01:31:04,070 --> 01:31:01,760
something like that

2459
01:31:04,910 --> 01:31:04,080
we'd get our telescopes on we'd look at

2460
01:31:06,070 --> 01:31:04,920
the stars

2461
01:31:09,430 --> 01:31:06,080
[Music]

2462
01:31:11,510 --> 01:31:09,440
every night and one weekend is a joke

2463
01:31:13,510 --> 01:31:11,520
i thought they said well we saw

2464
01:31:14,229 --> 01:31:13,520
something like a ufo land over a hill

2465
01:31:15,510 --> 01:31:14,239
down

2466
01:31:17,510 --> 01:31:15,520
by our house he said the night you

2467
01:31:19,030 --> 01:31:17,520
weren't there i think it's kind of like

2468
01:31:20,470 --> 01:31:19,040
a campfire thing let's kind of

2469
01:31:22,149 --> 01:31:20,480
tell him some story and kind of get him

2470
01:31:23,590 --> 01:31:22,159
scared you know

2471
01:31:25,430 --> 01:31:23,600
well i didn't think a whole lot about it

2472
01:31:26,709 --> 01:31:25,440
even at that age

2473
01:31:28,950 --> 01:31:26,719
but then all of a sudden i started

2474
01:31:30,629 --> 01:31:28,960
developing a paranoia

2475
01:31:32,229 --> 01:31:30,639
that like something was coming every

2476
01:31:34,709 --> 01:31:32,239
night

2477
01:31:35,590 --> 01:31:34,719
and i had bouts of sleep paralysis

2478
01:31:38,870 --> 01:31:35,600
martin

2479
01:31:40,229 --> 01:31:38,880
that started intensifying and some of

2480
01:31:41,430 --> 01:31:40,239
this thing that you know i thought back

2481
01:31:43,350 --> 01:31:41,440
about for years you have

2482
01:31:45,189 --> 01:31:43,360
maybe just it's a young kid being

2483
01:31:46,790 --> 01:31:45,199
paranoid being afraid

2484
01:31:48,790 --> 01:31:46,800
i had the feeling something was coming

2485
01:31:52,629 --> 01:31:48,800
always from the same area

2486
01:31:56,709 --> 01:31:52,639
that i had feelings of being levitated

2487
01:32:01,350 --> 01:32:00,149
they kept intensifying i kept

2488
01:32:03,110 --> 01:32:01,360
having a feeling that something was

2489
01:32:04,550 --> 01:32:03,120
there at night in the room even i would

2490
01:32:06,870 --> 01:32:04,560
i would be tearing the room apart at

2491
01:32:09,350 --> 01:32:06,880
night looking for something every night

2492
01:32:10,390 --> 01:32:09,360
my parents never knew about it i started

2493
01:32:12,310 --> 01:32:10,400
developing

2494
01:32:13,669 --> 01:32:12,320
some medical conditions along with it

2495
01:32:14,870 --> 01:32:13,679
that may have been associated with it i

2496
01:32:18,229 --> 01:32:14,880
think

2497
01:32:21,430 --> 01:32:18,239
but it started going on and we relocated

2498
01:32:24,870 --> 01:32:21,440
to another location again more rural

2499
01:32:25,350 --> 01:32:24,880
um i met a friend and these by the way

2500
01:32:28,790 --> 01:32:25,360
these

2501
01:32:31,110 --> 01:32:28,800
sleep paralysis still kept coming along

2502
01:32:32,550 --> 01:32:31,120
and one one day my buddy says hey let's

2503
01:32:34,870 --> 01:32:32,560
go out hunting

2504
01:32:36,149 --> 01:32:34,880
well our hunting was really not hunting

2505
01:32:39,030 --> 01:32:36,159
animals it was more like shooting

2506
01:32:40,950 --> 01:32:39,040
refrigerators any abandoned appliances

2507
01:32:42,709 --> 01:32:40,960
anything that was abandoned in the peach

2508
01:32:44,550 --> 01:32:42,719
orchards in the fields down in the area

2509
01:32:46,950 --> 01:32:44,560
i lived at

2510
01:32:48,629 --> 01:32:46,960
so we're out walking in this rural area

2511
01:32:50,470 --> 01:32:48,639
in south carolina

2512
01:32:51,990 --> 01:32:50,480
we go out behind my buddy's house we go

2513
01:32:53,510 --> 01:32:52,000
deeper and deeper and deeper into the

2514
01:32:55,350 --> 01:32:53,520
woods

2515
01:32:56,629 --> 01:32:55,360
and all of a sudden i look up and i see

2516
01:32:58,870 --> 01:32:56,639
this

2517
01:33:00,390 --> 01:32:58,880
silver disk hovering directly above the

2518
01:33:03,510 --> 01:33:00,400
trees right above us

2519
01:33:06,470 --> 01:33:03,520
it wasn't like it was the sun it was the

2520
01:33:07,910 --> 01:33:06,480
size of a car directly above the trees

2521
01:33:09,750 --> 01:33:07,920
and just so that you know right before

2522
01:33:11,350 --> 01:33:09,760
that the one part i forgot to put in the

2523
01:33:13,030 --> 01:33:11,360
story is

2524
01:33:14,870 --> 01:33:13,040
as we're getting deeper in the woods my

2525
01:33:17,430 --> 01:33:14,880
buddy's getting more nervous

2526
01:33:20,550 --> 01:33:17,440
he's getting scared and he's at this

2527
01:33:22,149 --> 01:33:20,560
time he's 15 and i'm 13.

2528
01:33:24,229 --> 01:33:22,159
and he says you know there's a swamp

2529
01:33:26,950 --> 01:33:24,239
willie back here

2530
01:33:28,390 --> 01:33:26,960
implying like a bigfoot and i said

2531
01:33:29,990 --> 01:33:28,400
really i got a shotgun man i ain't

2532
01:33:33,270 --> 01:33:30,000
afraid to do a bigfoot

2533
01:33:35,430 --> 01:33:33,280
reality was i probably dropped it ran

2534
01:33:36,470 --> 01:33:35,440
but we're going deeper in the woods and

2535
01:33:38,550 --> 01:33:36,480
the thing is instead of

2536
01:33:40,070 --> 01:33:38,560
going out of the woods since he started

2537
01:33:42,870 --> 01:33:40,080
getting that scared he actually started

2538
01:33:45,430 --> 01:33:42,880
going deeper and deeper into the woods

2539
01:33:47,590 --> 01:33:45,440
and he started almost running he started

2540
01:33:49,270 --> 01:33:47,600
going that fast

2541
01:33:50,950 --> 01:33:49,280
once we got so deep back in the woods

2542
01:33:53,110 --> 01:33:50,960
that's why i looked up and i saw

2543
01:33:55,669 --> 01:33:53,120
the ufo hovering directly above us it

2544
01:33:57,990 --> 01:33:55,679
was a dis-shaped object

2545
01:33:59,750 --> 01:33:58,000
just completely emotionless and as we're

2546
01:34:01,430 --> 01:33:59,760
going walking it almost seems like it's

2547
01:34:04,229 --> 01:34:01,440
following us as we're going deeper into

2548
01:34:06,790 --> 01:34:04,239
the woods

2549
01:34:07,270 --> 01:34:06,800
he's he starts freaking out and he i

2550
01:34:10,709 --> 01:34:07,280
don't

2551
01:34:12,950 --> 01:34:10,719
above us

2552
01:34:14,470 --> 01:34:12,960
no for some reason i don't know why i

2553
01:34:16,149 --> 01:34:14,480
just keep looking up

2554
01:34:18,229 --> 01:34:16,159
is i'm looking down at him looking up

2555
01:34:22,390 --> 01:34:18,239
looking down looking up looking down

2556
01:34:24,790 --> 01:34:22,400
and he's running we eventually

2557
01:34:26,550 --> 01:34:24,800
break out of the woods way far away from

2558
01:34:29,270 --> 01:34:26,560
our house

2559
01:34:30,550 --> 01:34:29,280
we hit this little small tar-covered

2560
01:34:32,390 --> 01:34:30,560
road

2561
01:34:34,310 --> 01:34:32,400
that's just dirt with a little layer of

2562
01:34:36,950 --> 01:34:34,320
um almost like a

2563
01:34:38,790 --> 01:34:36,960
layer of like tar like you put in your

2564
01:34:40,709 --> 01:34:38,800
driveway on top of just to keep the dust

2565
01:34:42,470 --> 01:34:40,719
down

2566
01:34:44,550 --> 01:34:42,480
we hit that road and we start walking

2567
01:34:46,390 --> 01:34:44,560
back and he says you know there's a big

2568
01:34:48,790 --> 01:34:46,400
white owl standing in front of us back

2569
01:34:50,550 --> 01:34:48,800
in the woods

2570
01:34:51,830 --> 01:34:50,560
we're talking about a white owl back in

2571
01:34:53,270 --> 01:34:51,840
the woods man

2572
01:34:55,109 --> 01:34:53,280
and he starts motioning like this thing

2573
01:34:57,350 --> 01:34:55,119
was about four feet high

2574
01:34:59,669 --> 01:34:57,360
it had big black eyes was standing right

2575
01:35:01,750 --> 01:34:59,679
in front of us in the woods

2576
01:35:04,550 --> 01:35:01,760
isn't that incredible you've heard

2577
01:35:07,590 --> 01:35:04,560
stories about allison sin right

2578
01:35:10,390 --> 01:35:07,600
actually yeah i talked to um mclean

2579
01:35:12,229 --> 01:35:10,400
mclean yeah we talked one night for like

2580
01:35:15,990 --> 01:35:12,239
an hour and a half about this

2581
01:35:18,870 --> 01:35:16,000
yeah and i never heard that story under

2582
01:35:22,149 --> 01:35:18,880
martin about the owls

2583
01:35:23,669 --> 01:35:22,159
but i he says and he kept going over and

2584
01:35:26,310 --> 01:35:23,679
over and over and over again

2585
01:35:27,750 --> 01:35:26,320
all the way back as we're walking home i

2586
01:35:29,270 --> 01:35:27,760
don't know how many miles it was telling

2587
01:35:30,790 --> 01:35:29,280
me about this owl that was standing in

2588
01:35:32,550 --> 01:35:30,800
front of us

2589
01:35:34,070 --> 01:35:32,560
well he's talking about the owl and i

2590
01:35:35,590 --> 01:35:34,080
never told him about the ufo that was

2591
01:35:39,189 --> 01:35:35,600
hovering directly above us the whole

2592
01:35:43,750 --> 01:35:42,229
so well i tried to follow up by the way

2593
01:35:45,270 --> 01:35:43,760
multiple times since then but i found

2594
01:35:47,189 --> 01:35:45,280
that he actually died two years after

2595
01:35:50,470 --> 01:35:47,199
that event happened

2596
01:35:53,030 --> 01:35:50,480
because we moved away from the region

2597
01:35:53,669 --> 01:35:53,040
but i had a feeling that something

2598
01:35:56,790 --> 01:35:53,679
happened

2599
01:35:57,510 --> 01:35:56,800
during that time frame and i don't know

2600
01:36:01,990 --> 01:35:57,520
what it was

2601
01:36:03,590 --> 01:36:02,000
because i also started um

2602
01:36:05,669 --> 01:36:03,600
like something may have happened but i

2603
01:36:08,149 --> 01:36:05,679
didn't really pursue it

2604
01:36:10,229 --> 01:36:08,159
then it was about uh six years ago now

2605
01:36:11,750 --> 01:36:10,239
maybe seven years ago

2606
01:36:13,990 --> 01:36:11,760
aaron clark who's with the cleveland

2607
01:36:16,229 --> 01:36:14,000
group i was with said hey tom

2608
01:36:18,550 --> 01:36:16,239
um did anything ever happened to you so

2609
01:36:21,030 --> 01:36:18,560
i told him the story

2610
01:36:22,629 --> 01:36:21,040
and he goes really and next thing you

2611
01:36:25,590 --> 01:36:22,639
know he says i put a call in for a

2612
01:36:27,030 --> 01:36:25,600
friend of ours who does regressions

2613
01:36:29,510 --> 01:36:27,040
he goes would you consider being

2614
01:36:33,030 --> 01:36:29,520
regressed

2615
01:36:35,189 --> 01:36:33,040
i said well at the same time

2616
01:36:36,790 --> 01:36:35,199
that um we were talking about all this

2617
01:36:37,990 --> 01:36:36,800
we're planning on having a meeting where

2618
01:36:39,910 --> 01:36:38,000
we brought up about people

2619
01:36:41,189 --> 01:36:39,920
who had potential abduction experiences

2620
01:36:42,709 --> 01:36:41,199
i said well

2621
01:36:44,229 --> 01:36:42,719
what better way to kind of feel like a

2622
01:36:45,990 --> 01:36:44,239
lot of these people but to maybe go

2623
01:36:47,270 --> 01:36:46,000
through a number of these things that

2624
01:36:48,870 --> 01:36:47,280
individuals who have had these

2625
01:36:50,310 --> 01:36:48,880
experiences go through so let's go ahead

2626
01:36:53,189 --> 01:36:50,320
and do the regression

2627
01:36:54,870 --> 01:36:53,199
i want to see you know what happens what

2628
01:36:57,030 --> 01:36:54,880
these people go through

2629
01:36:58,950 --> 01:36:57,040
the person i had to do the regressions

2630
01:37:00,709 --> 01:36:58,960
was with mufon

2631
01:37:01,990 --> 01:37:00,719
uh they'd done a number of them over the

2632
01:37:04,229 --> 01:37:02,000
years and one thing i want to make sure

2633
01:37:08,629 --> 01:37:04,239
is they didn't lead me

2634
01:37:10,550 --> 01:37:08,639
right so we recorded everything

2635
01:37:12,229 --> 01:37:10,560
and when she started doing the

2636
01:37:14,550 --> 01:37:12,239
regression with me

2637
01:37:15,590 --> 01:37:14,560
uh she started taking me back to that

2638
01:37:18,830 --> 01:37:15,600
time frame when

2639
01:37:21,830 --> 01:37:18,840
i remembered having some of the

2640
01:37:24,229 --> 01:37:21,840
um basically the um

2641
01:37:25,590 --> 01:37:24,239
sleep paralysis into the situation in

2642
01:37:26,629 --> 01:37:25,600
south carolina right around when all

2643
01:37:29,189 --> 01:37:26,639
these events

2644
01:37:30,950 --> 01:37:29,199
were happening she just took me back to

2645
01:37:33,669 --> 01:37:30,960
that time frame and let me describe

2646
01:37:33,990 --> 01:37:33,679
things that were going around around me

2647
01:37:35,510 --> 01:37:34,000
because

2648
01:37:37,189 --> 01:37:35,520
it wasn't like she was looking at me say

2649
01:37:38,629 --> 01:37:37,199
saying take tell me about the great

2650
01:37:40,229 --> 01:37:38,639
aliens you saw

2651
01:37:44,629 --> 01:37:40,239
there was nothing like that ever brought

2652
01:37:47,830 --> 01:37:44,639
up she took me back to that time frame

2653
01:37:49,270 --> 01:37:47,840
and i was describing being basically

2654
01:37:51,350 --> 01:37:49,280
taken

2655
01:37:52,310 --> 01:37:51,360
from my house at that time going as i

2656
01:37:56,070 --> 01:37:52,320
left

2657
01:37:57,669 --> 01:37:56,080
and i ended up in like a domed room that

2658
01:37:58,950 --> 01:37:57,679
i couldn't really see any walls and it

2659
01:38:02,470 --> 01:37:58,960
was just like

2660
01:38:03,910 --> 01:38:02,480
empty space and i remembered in this

2661
01:38:07,510 --> 01:38:03,920
case

2662
01:38:09,830 --> 01:38:07,520
seeing a alien

2663
01:38:11,510 --> 01:38:09,840
in front of me that somewhat like a gray

2664
01:38:15,109 --> 01:38:11,520
except a little bit more evil

2665
01:38:17,750 --> 01:38:15,119
looking standing and basically standing

2666
01:38:21,109 --> 01:38:17,760
in front of me

2667
01:38:23,590 --> 01:38:21,119
and i'm like wow i'm thinking huh

2668
01:38:25,669 --> 01:38:23,600
and all this stuff is coming out i

2669
01:38:27,430 --> 01:38:25,679
described in this case

2670
01:38:29,910 --> 01:38:27,440
not being medically examined like with

2671
01:38:30,950 --> 01:38:29,920
instruments and so forth on there but

2672
01:38:33,910 --> 01:38:30,960
basically being

2673
01:38:37,030 --> 01:38:33,920
almost like it was looking in my mind

2674
01:38:38,550 --> 01:38:37,040
examining what was going on in my mind

2675
01:38:41,270 --> 01:38:38,560
this whole time i couldn't move i

2676
01:38:45,430 --> 01:38:41,280
couldn't do anything

2677
01:38:47,109 --> 01:38:45,440
no matter how hard i tried so

2678
01:38:49,189 --> 01:38:47,119
we hit a point where we couldn't go any

2679
01:38:51,030 --> 01:38:49,199
farther

2680
01:38:53,669 --> 01:38:51,040
we tried exploring some other areas

2681
01:38:54,950 --> 01:38:53,679
where we went back to another situation

2682
01:38:56,870 --> 01:38:54,960
where

2683
01:38:58,070 --> 01:38:56,880
again i was out in the woods just doing

2684
01:39:01,270 --> 01:38:58,080
some general

2685
01:39:02,550 --> 01:39:01,280
nosing around and something was pursuing

2686
01:39:04,950 --> 01:39:02,560
me through the woods that i could not

2687
01:39:06,550 --> 01:39:04,960
turn around to look at

2688
01:39:09,030 --> 01:39:06,560
but as i'm going one direction in the

2689
01:39:10,870 --> 01:39:09,040
woods i try to get out of the woods and

2690
01:39:12,070 --> 01:39:10,880
it basically cuts me off and force me

2691
01:39:15,510 --> 01:39:12,080
back into the woods without

2692
01:39:17,510 --> 01:39:15,520
seeing it so we went

2693
01:39:18,870 --> 01:39:17,520
through that situation she said for the

2694
01:39:22,070 --> 01:39:18,880
first regression

2695
01:39:23,910 --> 01:39:22,080
we went on for an hour and a half she'd

2696
01:39:27,189 --> 01:39:23,920
never heard so much come out in one time

2697
01:39:29,109 --> 01:39:27,199
she said for a first time

2698
01:39:31,990 --> 01:39:29,119
we went back and did several other

2699
01:39:34,870 --> 01:39:32,000
regressions after that where

2700
01:39:37,350 --> 01:39:34,880
when i was being i don't for lack of a

2701
01:39:40,310 --> 01:39:37,360
better word evaluated

2702
01:39:41,910 --> 01:39:40,320
i remembered something that this thing

2703
01:39:44,790 --> 01:39:41,920
was basically right in my face

2704
01:39:46,229 --> 01:39:44,800
that image that stereotype image for

2705
01:39:49,109 --> 01:39:46,239
this thing is like right in my face

2706
01:39:50,550 --> 01:39:49,119
looking at me i see these huge black

2707
01:39:52,550 --> 01:39:50,560
eyes

2708
01:39:53,990 --> 01:39:52,560
and all of a sudden under martin i could

2709
01:39:57,189 --> 01:39:54,000
peer into its mind

2710
01:39:59,350 --> 01:39:57,199
it's like there was a connection

2711
01:40:00,870 --> 01:39:59,360
and i sensed what was on its mind i also

2712
01:40:02,470 --> 01:40:00,880
sensed that there were other beings all

2713
01:40:06,390 --> 01:40:02,480
over the place

2714
01:40:09,830 --> 01:40:08,390
and all of a sudden i kept i started

2715
01:40:11,109 --> 01:40:09,840
telling her something went wrong

2716
01:40:13,910 --> 01:40:11,119
something went wrong something went

2717
01:40:15,669 --> 01:40:13,920
wrong something went wrong

2718
01:40:17,350 --> 01:40:15,679
and what went wrong was i was not

2719
01:40:19,189 --> 01:40:17,360
supposed to be able to see inside of its

2720
01:40:21,030 --> 01:40:19,199
mind

2721
01:40:22,950 --> 01:40:21,040
that was a sensation i was left with

2722
01:40:24,790 --> 01:40:22,960
afterwards

2723
01:40:26,709 --> 01:40:24,800
and it was doing everything it could to

2724
01:40:28,709 --> 01:40:26,719
try to shut down that connection after

2725
01:40:32,390 --> 01:40:28,719
that

2726
01:40:34,310 --> 01:40:32,400
certain cases

2727
01:40:37,350 --> 01:40:34,320
i don't claim i'm psychic again i don't

2728
01:40:39,830 --> 01:40:37,360
even claim really abducted i just

2729
01:40:41,270 --> 01:40:39,840
putting this out for thought that

2730
01:40:44,149 --> 01:40:41,280
sometimes there's like a connection

2731
01:40:50,070 --> 01:40:46,149
um david wants to know if he had any

2732
01:40:53,910 --> 01:40:50,080
health issues

2733
01:40:55,350 --> 01:40:53,920
that time frame got serious enough i

2734
01:40:58,149 --> 01:40:55,360
developed ulcers so bad

2735
01:40:59,350 --> 01:40:58,159
so david knows that at 15 i had to do

2736
01:41:01,669 --> 01:40:59,360
surgery

2737
01:41:02,950 --> 01:41:01,679
through to basically surgically repair

2738
01:41:04,550 --> 01:41:02,960
the ulcers because no matter what

2739
01:41:05,910 --> 01:41:04,560
medication they tried or diet they had

2740
01:41:09,430 --> 01:41:05,920
me on they wouldn't heal

2741
01:41:11,430 --> 01:41:09,440
15 years old and the doctor i talked to

2742
01:41:12,550 --> 01:41:11,440
i went back and saw the doctor years

2743
01:41:15,590 --> 01:41:12,560
later

2744
01:41:16,709 --> 01:41:15,600
he was my family doctor surgeon

2745
01:41:18,229 --> 01:41:16,719
and he goes yeah i remember when i

2746
01:41:21,669 --> 01:41:18,239
operated on you at 15 he says you were

2747
01:41:23,590 --> 01:41:21,679
two weeks away from dying on the table

2748
01:41:25,750 --> 01:41:23,600
he says you were the worst case he'd

2749
01:41:28,590 --> 01:41:25,760
ever seen

2750
01:41:30,470 --> 01:41:28,600
wow but once they'd removed him

2751
01:41:33,430 --> 01:41:30,480
[Music]

2752
01:41:35,270 --> 01:41:33,440
things still continued but i'd always

2753
01:41:36,629 --> 01:41:35,280
wondered if maybe the result of the all

2754
01:41:39,510 --> 01:41:36,639
the ulcers weren't the result of all

2755
01:41:41,109 --> 01:41:39,520
this thing going on

2756
01:41:42,550 --> 01:41:41,119
because here's another wild thing on

2757
01:41:44,550 --> 01:41:42,560
here you know i mentioned about the owl

2758
01:41:46,470 --> 01:41:44,560
under martin

2759
01:41:48,550 --> 01:41:46,480
after we had that experiences like a

2760
01:41:50,310 --> 01:41:48,560
week or two later

2761
01:41:52,550 --> 01:41:50,320
and i'm not making this stuff up this is

2762
01:41:55,270 --> 01:41:52,560
too good to make up

2763
01:41:56,790 --> 01:41:55,280
we had a car coming down our dirt road

2764
01:41:59,510 --> 01:41:56,800
that we lived on

2765
01:42:00,149 --> 01:41:59,520
the car would pull in my driveway and my

2766
01:42:02,149 --> 01:42:00,159
buddy's

2767
01:42:04,470 --> 01:42:02,159
house this big old farmhouse is directly

2768
01:42:06,310 --> 01:42:04,480
across the road from mine

2769
01:42:07,750 --> 01:42:06,320
it'd pull and shine its lights in my our

2770
01:42:09,830 --> 01:42:07,760
house every night

2771
01:42:10,870 --> 01:42:09,840
in the drive and no my dad wouldn't call

2772
01:42:13,510 --> 01:42:10,880
the sheriff my

2773
01:42:15,030 --> 01:42:13,520
mom would call the sheriff nobody called

2774
01:42:16,470 --> 01:42:15,040
the police but if we just have this car

2775
01:42:17,189 --> 01:42:16,480
pulling every night and back out and

2776
01:42:21,270 --> 01:42:17,199
take off

2777
01:42:23,590 --> 01:42:21,280
well

2778
01:42:24,390 --> 01:42:23,600
back as a kid i can make out cars and

2779
01:42:26,790 --> 01:42:24,400
determine

2780
01:42:32,310 --> 01:42:26,800
what type of car you're looking at it

2781
01:42:36,390 --> 01:42:35,030
one night we're walking down the road uh

2782
01:42:37,990 --> 01:42:36,400
me and a buddy decided to go up and get

2783
01:42:40,070 --> 01:42:38,000
a soda at the

2784
01:42:41,910 --> 01:42:40,080
a local gas station we'd walk down this

2785
01:42:42,790 --> 01:42:41,920
dirt road we lived on there's a gas

2786
01:42:45,910 --> 01:42:42,800
station about a half

2787
01:42:47,990 --> 01:42:45,920
mile mile down the road it's at night we

2788
01:42:49,910 --> 01:42:48,000
get some sow to come back

2789
01:42:52,229 --> 01:42:49,920
and we hear a car coming up down this

2790
01:42:54,149 --> 01:42:52,239
dirt road

2791
01:42:55,990 --> 01:42:54,159
we can make out the silhouette of a car

2792
01:42:59,350 --> 01:42:56,000
but we can't see there's no lights on

2793
01:43:01,430 --> 01:42:59,360
it the the car starts coming at us we

2794
01:43:03,189 --> 01:43:01,440
run off the road up into peach orchard

2795
01:43:05,350 --> 01:43:03,199
to get off the road that far

2796
01:43:06,470 --> 01:43:05,360
the car swerves back down the ditch as

2797
01:43:09,350 --> 01:43:06,480
far as it can get up

2798
01:43:10,470 --> 01:43:09,360
to try to get at us they hit us wow it

2799
01:43:14,870 --> 01:43:10,480
missed us

2800
01:43:17,350 --> 01:43:14,880
and it was at ford galaxy chase

2801
01:43:19,270 --> 01:43:17,360
crazy and this was way before any of the

2802
01:43:24,790 --> 01:43:19,280
stuff of the men in black and anything

2803
01:43:27,270 --> 01:43:24,800
ever came out this was about 1968.

2804
01:43:28,629 --> 01:43:27,280
wow um ellie wants to know do you

2805
01:43:31,189 --> 01:43:28,639
experience regular

2806
01:43:32,709 --> 01:43:31,199
synchronicities in your daily life i've

2807
01:43:35,830 --> 01:43:32,719
had a number of them

2808
01:43:41,030 --> 01:43:35,840
in my daily life these connections it's

2809
01:43:44,149 --> 01:43:41,040
pop up out of nowhere it's like

2810
01:43:46,229 --> 01:43:44,159
this is just incredible

2811
01:43:47,189 --> 01:43:46,239
there's certain things that like i'll

2812
01:43:48,790 --> 01:43:47,199
realize um

2813
01:43:51,109 --> 01:43:48,800
matter of fact here's one related to a

2814
01:43:53,270 --> 01:43:51,119
completely different case under martin

2815
01:43:54,870 --> 01:43:53,280
i did a long distance case down in

2816
01:43:57,270 --> 01:43:54,880
puerto rico where i was interviewing to

2817
01:44:01,270 --> 01:43:57,280
witness my phone

2818
01:44:04,550 --> 01:44:01,280
they described seeing lights in the sky

2819
01:44:06,229 --> 01:44:04,560
closer to the house so i called the

2820
01:44:07,350 --> 01:44:06,239
witness up we're talking on the phone i

2821
01:44:08,550 --> 01:44:07,360
said you know tell me about you know

2822
01:44:11,510 --> 01:44:08,560
this light she goes well

2823
01:44:12,629 --> 01:44:11,520
i was driving down the road and these

2824
01:44:15,030 --> 01:44:12,639
lights were following me

2825
01:44:16,790 --> 01:44:15,040
i'm like okay she goes i pull in my

2826
01:44:18,550 --> 01:44:16,800
mom's house told my mom about it and she

2827
01:44:20,629 --> 01:44:18,560
doesn't believe me

2828
01:44:23,350 --> 01:44:20,639
and i show her the lights i leave and

2829
01:44:27,189 --> 01:44:23,360
the lights follow me again

2830
01:44:29,270 --> 01:44:27,199
okay well she doesn't see anything else

2831
01:44:33,109 --> 01:44:29,280
that she's she's you know she's focused

2832
01:44:36,790 --> 01:44:33,119
on that and all of a sudden in my mind

2833
01:44:38,390 --> 01:44:36,800
i see an image of somebody sitting in a

2834
01:44:40,229 --> 01:44:38,400
dark room

2835
01:44:43,669 --> 01:44:40,239
looking at windows that you can see like

2836
01:44:45,990 --> 01:44:43,679
ambient light coming in from the night

2837
01:44:47,750 --> 01:44:46,000
as i'm seeing these windows in front of

2838
01:44:49,830 --> 01:44:47,760
me with the ambient light i see the

2839
01:44:51,990 --> 01:44:49,840
silhouette of a short figure standing in

2840
01:44:55,669 --> 01:44:52,000
front of the windows

2841
01:44:57,350 --> 01:44:55,679
also what was unusual is this figure was

2842
01:44:58,870 --> 01:44:57,360
not standing at normal room heights it

2843
01:45:00,390 --> 01:44:58,880
had to be lowered in room height for

2844
01:45:01,910 --> 01:45:00,400
some reason but i couldn't figure out

2845
01:45:03,830 --> 01:45:01,920
why but i'm seeing the silhouette of

2846
01:45:05,669 --> 01:45:03,840
this figure

2847
01:45:07,189 --> 01:45:05,679
and she goes you know let me tell you

2848
01:45:08,390 --> 01:45:07,199
about some other experiences because me

2849
01:45:11,270 --> 01:45:08,400
and my mom

2850
01:45:12,790 --> 01:45:11,280
have had experiences throughout her life

2851
01:45:14,790 --> 01:45:12,800
she goes one night i was sitting in my

2852
01:45:16,470 --> 01:45:14,800
living room at home

2853
01:45:17,669 --> 01:45:16,480
i said okay tell me about you know your

2854
01:45:18,950 --> 01:45:17,679
living room she says well i'm sitting in

2855
01:45:21,430 --> 01:45:18,960
the living room at night

2856
01:45:23,270 --> 01:45:21,440
looking at the windows and i see a

2857
01:45:26,550 --> 01:45:23,280
figure silhouetted

2858
01:45:27,990 --> 01:45:26,560
in the windows i said really

2859
01:45:30,629 --> 01:45:28,000
what about the figure she goes well the

2860
01:45:31,990 --> 01:45:30,639
figure was short

2861
01:45:33,510 --> 01:45:32,000
and it's standing in front of the window

2862
01:45:35,270 --> 01:45:33,520
is i can't make out the features but i

2863
01:45:37,270 --> 01:45:35,280
can see a silhouette

2864
01:45:38,950 --> 01:45:37,280
i said tell me more about you know your

2865
01:45:40,550 --> 01:45:38,960
house she goes well the room i was in

2866
01:45:43,189 --> 01:45:40,560
you go forward and you step down like

2867
01:45:45,510 --> 01:45:43,199
two steps into another level

2868
01:45:46,950 --> 01:45:45,520
and that's where the figure was at and

2869
01:45:49,910 --> 01:45:46,960
i'm like

2870
01:45:51,830 --> 01:45:49,920
how did i see that before she ever said

2871
01:45:54,149 --> 01:45:51,840
a word

2872
01:45:56,870 --> 01:45:54,159
wow everything she described to me i saw

2873
01:45:59,910 --> 01:45:56,880
before she did it

2874
01:46:02,070 --> 01:45:59,920
bizarre huh yeah it's like

2875
01:46:04,070 --> 01:46:02,080
occasionally these things pop up out of

2876
01:46:07,109 --> 01:46:04,080
nowhere

2877
01:46:08,629 --> 01:46:07,119
i think a lot of synchronicities do you

2878
01:46:11,510 --> 01:46:08,639
know like they just happened

2879
01:46:12,470 --> 01:46:11,520
it's like bizarre i've had some number

2880
01:46:15,669 --> 01:46:12,480
of things happen

2881
01:46:18,950 --> 01:46:15,679
over the years a question here

2882
01:46:21,910 --> 01:46:18,960
from neil is have you looked into the ob

2883
01:46:24,149 --> 01:46:21,920
monroe institute that your childhood

2884
01:46:27,030 --> 01:46:24,159
experiences sound very similar

2885
01:46:27,669 --> 01:46:27,040
no i haven't are you familiar with it at

2886
01:46:30,629 --> 01:46:27,679
all

2887
01:46:31,590 --> 01:46:30,639
no i'm not that familiar with it but you

2888
01:46:34,390 --> 01:46:31,600
have heard of it

2889
01:46:36,629 --> 01:46:34,400
i've had i've heard of it on there but i

2890
01:46:39,189 --> 01:46:36,639
haven't looked into it and

2891
01:46:40,310 --> 01:46:39,199
one of the reasons why maybe is because

2892
01:46:41,430 --> 01:46:40,320
you know this

2893
01:46:43,270 --> 01:46:41,440
the things that came out on the

2894
01:46:44,950 --> 01:46:43,280
regressions every day i'm still almost

2895
01:46:45,510 --> 01:46:44,960
on the fence did it happen did it not

2896
01:46:47,510 --> 01:46:45,520
happen

2897
01:46:48,709 --> 01:46:47,520
yeah i think a lot of people have

2898
01:46:52,149 --> 01:46:48,719
exactly that feeling

2899
01:46:53,510 --> 01:46:52,159
i've heard that and then when you

2900
01:46:55,270 --> 01:46:53,520
is what's interesting is when you get

2901
01:46:56,229 --> 01:46:55,280
that point where you're saying ah didn't

2902
01:46:58,070 --> 01:46:56,239
happen

2903
01:46:59,990 --> 01:46:58,080
then all of a sudden something pops out

2904
01:47:03,270 --> 01:47:00,000
of freaking nowhere

2905
01:47:06,310 --> 01:47:03,280
that blows your mind uh

2906
01:47:09,430 --> 01:47:06,320
like in this case i had um one

2907
01:47:11,590 --> 01:47:09,440
another individual mufon

2908
01:47:13,510 --> 01:47:11,600
we had contact the she was out of new

2909
01:47:15,669 --> 01:47:13,520
york

2910
01:47:17,350 --> 01:47:15,679
and she was telling me one day on on a

2911
01:47:18,870 --> 01:47:17,360
call she goes you know

2912
01:47:21,990 --> 01:47:18,880
a friend of mine also has had

2913
01:47:23,750 --> 01:47:22,000
experiences like she's been taken

2914
01:47:26,229 --> 01:47:23,760
and she goes one day i was talking to

2915
01:47:28,310 --> 01:47:26,239
her and she goes she's describing people

2916
01:47:30,310 --> 01:47:28,320
around her

2917
01:47:33,189 --> 01:47:30,320
and she described somebody she says that

2918
01:47:35,030 --> 01:47:33,199
sounded exactly like you

2919
01:47:36,550 --> 01:47:35,040
somebody was tall the features were the

2920
01:47:36,870 --> 01:47:36,560
same she goes the guy even mentioned he

2921
01:47:39,910 --> 01:47:36,880
taught

2922
01:47:42,229 --> 01:47:39,920
martial arts for a number of years

2923
01:47:43,830 --> 01:47:42,239
and i said really she goes well i did

2924
01:47:45,750 --> 01:47:43,840
this test with her

2925
01:47:47,669 --> 01:47:45,760
i gave her a number of photographs of

2926
01:47:49,510 --> 01:47:47,679
guys

2927
01:47:51,270 --> 01:47:49,520
and yours was one of them and she goes

2928
01:47:53,350 --> 01:47:51,280
she picked out your photograph out of

2929
01:47:55,669 --> 01:47:53,360
the group

2930
01:47:57,030 --> 01:47:55,679
wow and this was only like six seven

2931
01:48:02,229 --> 01:47:57,040
years ago

2932
01:48:03,990 --> 01:48:02,239
and i'm like wait a minute this story is

2933
01:48:06,470 --> 01:48:04,000
real you're freaking me out right now

2934
01:48:07,830 --> 01:48:06,480
you know a little bit wow that's

2935
01:48:11,030 --> 01:48:07,840
something else

2936
01:48:11,350 --> 01:48:11,040
um how about uh magnus wants to know do

2937
01:48:15,030 --> 01:48:11,360
you

2938
01:48:18,470 --> 01:48:15,040
have any paranormal experiences now

2939
01:48:21,830 --> 01:48:18,480
there are some times off and on where

2940
01:48:23,109 --> 01:48:21,840
it's more like sensations sensations

2941
01:48:25,270 --> 01:48:23,119
that something is around me some

2942
01:48:26,550 --> 01:48:25,280
sensations of almost like another

2943
01:48:29,270 --> 01:48:26,560
presence of time

2944
01:48:30,390 --> 01:48:29,280
i guess is the best way to put it one of

2945
01:48:33,590 --> 01:48:30,400
the things that we've

2946
01:48:38,870 --> 01:48:33,600
we've thought about doing is one of my

2947
01:48:40,870 --> 01:48:38,880
friends is he runs a paranormal group

2948
01:48:42,149 --> 01:48:40,880
and he's trying to always get me to come

2949
01:48:44,070 --> 01:48:42,159
down to

2950
01:48:46,229 --> 01:48:44,080
his paranormal group to go out to some

2951
01:48:48,229 --> 01:48:46,239
of these buildings that they're in

2952
01:48:51,030 --> 01:48:48,239
to see if i have any sensations in these

2953
01:48:52,229 --> 01:48:51,040
buildings that i'm around

2954
01:48:54,149 --> 01:48:52,239
just to look at it from another

2955
01:48:55,990 --> 01:48:54,159
perspective

2956
01:48:58,870 --> 01:48:56,000
in my case what i've come across

2957
01:49:01,990 --> 01:48:58,880
sometimes is almost like the

2958
01:49:04,229 --> 01:49:02,000
silhouettes of the figures in the corner

2959
01:49:06,070 --> 01:49:04,239
that sometimes i i say maybe is this

2960
01:49:07,670 --> 01:49:06,080
this is just my imagination it's running

2961
01:49:08,790 --> 01:49:07,680
wild but i have the sensation

2962
01:49:11,350 --> 01:49:08,800
[Music]

2963
01:49:13,030 --> 01:49:11,360
that sometimes something is there i call

2964
01:49:15,270 --> 01:49:13,040
it the best way to describe it on their

2965
01:49:17,350 --> 01:49:15,280
mark it's my spidey sense

2966
01:49:20,310 --> 01:49:17,360
that my body starts tingling at certain

2967
01:49:24,390 --> 01:49:22,149
like like i can be talking to certain

2968
01:49:26,149 --> 01:49:24,400
witnesses not all witnesses but certain

2969
01:49:26,950 --> 01:49:26,159
witnesses all suddenly tend to light up

2970
01:49:28,390 --> 01:49:26,960
like

2971
01:49:31,030 --> 01:49:28,400
wait a minute there's something here i'm

2972
01:49:33,189 --> 01:49:31,040
feeling there's some connection

2973
01:49:35,270 --> 01:49:33,199
and i'll start maybe trying to go deeper

2974
01:49:37,030 --> 01:49:35,280
in certain ways with

2975
01:49:38,310 --> 01:49:37,040
with the discussion and try to pull more

2976
01:49:41,270 --> 01:49:38,320
stuff out of them

2977
01:49:43,750 --> 01:49:41,280
based on these feelings now have you

2978
01:49:46,709 --> 01:49:43,760
talked to a lot about this

2979
01:49:48,790 --> 01:49:46,719
in public before i don't talk about a

2980
01:49:51,910 --> 01:49:48,800
lot in public i really don't

2981
01:49:52,950 --> 01:49:51,920
yeah i keep it more private because the

2982
01:49:54,950 --> 01:49:52,960
way i look at it

2983
01:49:56,390 --> 01:49:54,960
you know if i did go through abduction

2984
01:49:58,070 --> 01:49:56,400
experiences

2985
01:50:00,310 --> 01:49:58,080
what happened happened i can't change

2986
01:50:03,910 --> 01:50:00,320
that you know

2987
01:50:05,430 --> 01:50:03,920
uh and you said that you you kind of

2988
01:50:08,470 --> 01:50:05,440
question these things

2989
01:50:11,990 --> 01:50:08,480
you know um the

2990
01:50:14,709 --> 01:50:12,000
i guess what i'm getting at could

2991
01:50:16,229 --> 01:50:14,719
if if mufon knew your complete story

2992
01:50:19,589 --> 01:50:16,239
what you talked about tonight

2993
01:50:21,510 --> 01:50:19,599
could that affect your position is being

2994
01:50:22,950 --> 01:50:21,520
headed i don't know iowa state i don't

2995
01:50:25,510 --> 01:50:22,960
think it will

2996
01:50:26,950 --> 01:50:25,520
uh i think in this case you know that

2997
01:50:27,510 --> 01:50:26,960
they're exploring different things i

2998
01:50:29,030 --> 01:50:27,520
mean

2999
01:50:32,310 --> 01:50:29,040
you may have a number of people from

3000
01:50:33,830 --> 01:50:32,320
mufon have had similar experiences

3001
01:50:35,350 --> 01:50:33,840
and at times i wonder if a lot of

3002
01:50:36,550 --> 01:50:35,360
investigators out there may have

3003
01:50:38,310 --> 01:50:36,560
not have had some of their own

3004
01:50:40,629 --> 01:50:38,320
experiences in the past that maybe this

3005
01:50:42,470 --> 01:50:40,639
is what's kind of drawn it to them

3006
01:50:44,470 --> 01:50:42,480
uh to this almost like a moth being

3007
01:50:47,589 --> 01:50:44,480
drawn to the flame once in a while like

3008
01:50:50,310 --> 01:50:47,599
there is a connection here

3009
01:50:51,430 --> 01:50:50,320
yeah well a lot of people have come out

3010
01:50:54,310 --> 01:50:51,440
with some

3011
01:50:56,149 --> 01:50:54,320
very um unusual experiences that kind of

3012
01:50:59,589 --> 01:50:56,159
blew me away in the last

3013
01:51:02,870 --> 01:50:59,599
number of years you know robert salas

3014
01:51:05,109 --> 01:51:02,880
from the nuclear uh

3015
01:51:06,390 --> 01:51:05,119
and robert hastings and a number of

3016
01:51:08,390 --> 01:51:06,400
people have had

3017
01:51:09,830 --> 01:51:08,400
a claim they've had um you know

3018
01:51:11,669 --> 01:51:09,840
abduction experiences that

3019
01:51:13,669 --> 01:51:11,679
i've kind of i was kind of shocked

3020
01:51:15,430 --> 01:51:13,679
hearing that um

3021
01:51:16,709 --> 01:51:15,440
over the years we only have two minutes

3022
01:51:18,709 --> 01:51:16,719
left so

3023
01:51:21,030 --> 01:51:18,719
um i guess i'm going to ask you now

3024
01:51:23,430 --> 01:51:21,040
first of all if you would

3025
01:51:25,510 --> 01:51:23,440
let people know where they can listen to

3026
01:51:26,870 --> 01:51:25,520
your great podcast it's really good

3027
01:51:29,430 --> 01:51:26,880
well i appreciate that i've done a

3028
01:51:32,470 --> 01:51:29,440
podcast that's called you fatassy

3029
01:51:34,470 --> 01:51:32,480
they can actually find it on spotify and

3030
01:51:36,310 --> 01:51:34,480
other podcasting networks is these way

3031
01:51:38,870 --> 01:51:36,320
easiest way to find it

3032
01:51:40,550 --> 01:51:38,880
yeah and i've been laying low for last

3033
01:51:41,589 --> 01:51:40,560
few weeks just kind of taking some time

3034
01:51:43,510 --> 01:51:41,599
off a little bit

3035
01:51:44,629 --> 01:51:43,520
sure uh because like you know it's it's

3036
01:51:45,910 --> 01:51:44,639
intensive when you

3037
01:51:47,669 --> 01:51:45,920
when you do those and i do all mine

3038
01:51:48,870 --> 01:51:47,679
alone i record it late at night by the

3039
01:51:52,470 --> 01:51:48,880
way

3040
01:51:54,390 --> 01:51:52,480
typically just because of the

3041
01:51:57,270 --> 01:51:54,400
other things i have going on at home

3042
01:51:59,109 --> 01:51:57,280
sure i've got a really weird schedule

3043
01:52:00,709 --> 01:51:59,119
but right now our state chapter hasn't

3044
01:52:02,550 --> 01:52:00,719
had any local meetings because of

3045
01:52:04,149 --> 01:52:02,560
situations going on around the country

3046
01:52:05,750 --> 01:52:04,159
like everybody knows right now

3047
01:52:07,350 --> 01:52:05,760
yeah but we're going to be looking at

3048
01:52:08,149 --> 01:52:07,360
getting those probably going again this

3049
01:52:11,270 --> 01:52:08,159
next year

3050
01:52:13,109 --> 01:52:11,280
and if they go to mufonohio.com

3051
01:52:14,950 --> 01:52:13,119
they can find any of our event schedules

3052
01:52:17,750 --> 01:52:14,960
going forward because i like to do

3053
01:52:20,229 --> 01:52:17,760
about 20 to 30 talks around the region

3054
01:52:22,149 --> 01:52:20,239
throughout the year

3055
01:52:24,550 --> 01:52:22,159
excellent well thomas thank you so much

3056
01:52:26,070 --> 01:52:24,560
it's been it's been a real pleasure

3057
01:52:27,990 --> 01:52:26,080
you have a really good radio voice by

3058
01:52:29,589 --> 01:52:28,000
the way oh i appreciate that i've been

3059
01:52:32,870 --> 01:52:29,599
told that a number of times and

3060
01:52:34,870 --> 01:52:32,880
if yeah i i guess maybe have the face

3061
01:52:38,950 --> 01:52:34,880
for radio as they call it

3062
01:52:41,350 --> 01:52:38,960
i do too all right okay thanks so much

3063
01:52:42,550 --> 01:52:41,360
thank you all right take care okay you

3064
01:52:45,109 --> 01:52:42,560
too all right

3065
01:52:46,390 --> 01:52:45,119
so everyone uh i'll remind you that next

3066
01:52:50,310 --> 01:52:46,400
week we have

3067
01:52:50,790 --> 01:52:50,320
uh tim uh um sorry let me grab his name

3068
01:52:53,830 --> 01:52:50,800
again

3069
01:52:54,870 --> 01:52:53,840
yes it is tim tim senor he's gonna be on

3070
01:52:57,589 --> 01:52:54,880
he's gonna be talking about an

3071
01:52:58,470 --> 01:52:57,599
incredible uh ufo experience on the west

3072
01:53:00,950 --> 01:52:58,480
coast

3073
01:53:02,390 --> 01:53:00,960
and now thanks so much for uh listening

3074
01:53:05,830 --> 01:53:02,400
and i hope everyone has a

3075
01:53:08,629 --> 01:53:05,840
happy and healthy 2021.

3076
01:53:10,310 --> 01:53:08,639
we can get there i know we can all right

3077
01:53:12,100 --> 01:53:10,320
everyone thanks so much and remember to

3078
01:53:30,700 --> 01:53:12,110
keep your eyes to the sky